The second Will of the Collective led to a unique equipment, designed entirely by the community!

Which concept should the Will of the Collective choose?

Concept A (Dissidents in the Brig)
8
12%
Concept B (Controlling the Station)
19
28%
Concept C (Affiliation Bonus)
7
10%
Concept D (Opposition Verb)
1
1%
Concept E (Dominion War)
10
14%
Concept F (Dissidents BAD!)
No votes
0%
Concept G (TN's For the Cause)
No votes
0%
Concept H (+Decay)
1
1%
Concept I (Car + Dom Sitting In a Tree...)
23
33%
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Chief Programmer
By Maelwys (Chris Lobban)
 - Chief Programmer
 -  
Community Contributor
#40130
Danny wrote:I'm having a little trouble seeing where the interaction is being encouraged through Concept B.
I agree. It seems to reward players for holing up at home and not leaving their HQ, so it's actually discouraging interaction rather than encouraging it, at least in my understanding...
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First Edition Art Manager
By jjh (Johnny Holeva)
 - First Edition Art Manager
 -  
#40142
Maelwys wrote:
Danny wrote:I'm having a little trouble seeing where the interaction is being encouraged through Concept B.
I agree. It seems to reward players for holing up at home and not leaving their HQ, so it's actually discouraging interaction rather than encouraging it, at least in my understanding...
I'm seeing it from the other side of the coin. While the Terok Nor Player is trying to "control" the station, it will be (could be?) up to the opponent to interact and take control away from the Nor Player.

For the record, I'm not a proponent of alternate victory conditions. In my mind, when I read Concept B I envisioned a bonus on the level of Enterprise-J.
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By Mugato
 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
#40146
Maelwys wrote:
Danny wrote:I'm having a little trouble seeing where the interaction is being encouraged through Concept B.
I agree. It seems to reward players for holing up at home and not leaving their HQ, so it's actually discouraging interaction rather than encouraging it, at least in my understanding...
What if it had something like a bonus for having more weapons there than your opponent has shields? or lets your opponent do something bad if they're there and your not.....
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 - Beta Quadrant
 -  
#40150
MidnightLich wrote: Concept A
A reward for having dissidents in an opponent's brig.
Well you'd either have to include some way of getting them there in that same card or use some other cards. If you use the former then its alot of text unless you did something simple like Biological Distinctiveness (i.e. Order - Place your Dissident in Opponents Brig, all ur peeps are Attr +1). Could be interesting.
MidnightLich wrote: Concept B
A bonus for "controlling the station" (keeping personnel/ships @ MotW)
Just thematic and could be cool if it gave your opponent a bonus for 'attacking' the station.
MidnightLich wrote:Concept C
A bonus for using multiple affiliations
I like that this could potentially be used by non-[TN] affiliations. I never liked the idea of coming up with a card that only one affiliation ould use in the first place.
MidnightLich wrote:Concept D
A verb with effects that depend entirely on the opponent's affiliation
With like 14 different affiliations in teh game you wouldn't fit it on a single card. So you'd have to come up with a number of generic effects that can't all be used so you just pick the best against a particular opponent
MidnightLich wrote:Concept E
A "dominion war" battle strategy that gives [TN] bonuses for victories.
The Dominion already have a massive number of battle cards. I don't see them needing this.
MidnightLich wrote:Concept F
A penalty for commanding Dissidents or [Fed] personnel; OR, a bonus for having Dissidents or [Fed] personnel in your discard pile.
Meh.
MidnightLich wrote:Concept G
A card that enables a For the Cause like attempting ability for [AQ] missions.
For the Cause is so out of date they had to make a Ship to do its work. So unless they give it special immunity it would leave some deck screwed against FSE.
MidnightLich wrote:Concept H
A way to extend the decay life of a decay card.
There is already Fifth and I suspect the designers are sorry they made that card. But I guess this could be handy for keeping the Reclaim Terok Nor around, but then you could always just make the next car...
MidnightLich wrote:Concept I
A card that links the [Car] and [Dom] affiliations (like Fitting In, or paying one affiliation's cost for the other's benefit.)
I definately like this, but as always you have to be careful not to make it too easy as you don't want them to get all teh benefits of a Dual-HQ deck without any of the drawbacks.
Last edited by Thanatos_elNyx on Fri Apr 10, 2009 2:07 pm, edited 2 times in total.
 
 - Alpha Quadrant
 -  
#40151
Concept B (Controlling the Station)

What if [TN] gets 5 points at the start of each turn if they have more personnel there then their opponent? This could give them a 2 mission solved option- earn the rest of the points another way -type deck

This would encourage a huge mix of species hanging out at the station! -and give a use to all those assassin cards out there?
User avatar
Chief Programmer
By Maelwys (Chris Lobban)
 - Chief Programmer
 -  
Community Contributor
#40157
MidnightLich wrote:Concept I
A card that links the [Car] and [Dom] affiliations (like Fitting In, or paying one affiliation's cost for the other's benefit.)
I like this one. I picture it being something along the sames lines as this LotR card (or even this and this), where you get a bonus for playing both affiliations and tapping into each other's resources. Yes, a dual-HQ deck could benefit as well, but at the penalty of being a dual-HQ deck, while a TN deck would be able to use it naturally.
User avatar
 
By Danny (Daniel Giddings)
 - Gamma Quadrant
 -  
Wanderer
2E European Continental Quarter-Finalist 2019
2E British National Second Runner-Up 2019
#40159
Maelwys wrote:
MidnightLich wrote:Concept I
A card that links the [Car] and [Dom] affiliations (like Fitting In, or paying one affiliation's cost for the other's benefit.)
I like this one. I picture it being something along the sames lines as this LotR card (or even this and this), where you get a bonus for playing both affiliations and tapping into each other's resources. Yes, a dual-HQ deck could benefit as well, but at the penalty of being a dual-HQ deck, while a TN deck would be able to use it naturally.
Like the fickle voting harlot I am, I can see that F's going to get very little love. To that end, I can see why I might be a better one. Personally, it makes me think of cards like this or this (obviously swapping out the named colours for Cardassian and Dominion affiliations).
 
By Foreman
 - Gamma Quadrant
 -  
#40168
Since B was one of my suggestions, I'll give an example of how it could provide interaction.

Event
Plays on mouth of the wormhole. Any player may initiate combat or engagements at this location. While a player has the highest total strength at this location that player's personnel are attributes +1 while attempting a mission. While a player has the most undamaged ships are this location, that players ships are all attributes +1.

So not only would you be able to attack the opponent at DS9/TN if you don't have a combat deck you can just occupy the station with your ships/personnel.

Obviously this is just an example, so the final card could have a different bonus.
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By Danny (Daniel Giddings)
 - Gamma Quadrant
 -  
Wanderer
2E European Continental Quarter-Finalist 2019
2E British National Second Runner-Up 2019
#40198
As much as I agree that 'promoting/providing interaction' is a good thing for the game, let us remember that the original brief was to come up with "An alternative strategy to Jake Sisko (Reporter Behind the Lines) for a Terok Nor deck."

I can't see 'controlling the station' doing that. If I'm playing a card that has the potential to give my opponent's peeps/ships bonuses for having more of them at my HQ than me, then I'm digging in and sitting tight (and who better to do that than Jake and his new stronger than average buddies). And if I don't have the strength/weapons, why would I risk playing that card?

On the other hand, I think a card that punishes the use of Mr. Sisko (or bestows blessings for having Dissidents in the discard pile) (F) or promotes interspecie chuminess between the Dominion and Cardassians (I) would fit the bill nicely.
 
By Foreman
 - Gamma Quadrant
 -  
#40228
Danny wrote: I can't see 'controlling the station' doing that. If I'm playing a card that has the potential to give my opponent's peeps/ships bonuses for having more of them at my HQ than me, then I'm digging in and sitting tight (and who better to do that than Jake and his new stronger than average buddies).
That is a good point that this card might actually just make the dissident deck stronger rather than making an alternate strategy for [TN]. That is definatly be something to keep in mid if the controlling the station idea wins (at the time of this post it is slightly ahead.)

I think that is a good argument against option A as well. It would also probably just increase the power of a dissident Jake deck.

Maybe a way to get around it is to have whatever bonus the card gives affect only non-dissidents.

Another idea would be if the card took hand-size into account somehow since most [TN] dissidents have to discard cards when they are played.
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Second Edition Design Manager
By The Guardian (Richard New)
 - Second Edition Design Manager
 -  
#40231
Foreman wrote:I think that is a good argument against option A as well. It would also probably just increase the power of a dissident Jake deck.
Really? I envisioned new versions of all of the Dissidents with "While this personnel is in an opponent's brig..." text. Including Jake (probably once again as the lynchpin to prevent a mishmash of strategies), so the player would have to pick one strategy or the other. I saw this WotC card as being an example. Not a super-strategy in one card. Those are doomed by cards that dismantle decks.
 
By Foreman
 - Gamma Quadrant
 -  
#40233
The Guardian wrote: Really? I envisioned new versions of all of the Dissidents with "While this personnel is in an opponent's brig..." text. Including Jake (probably once again as the lynchpin to prevent a mishmash of strategies), so the player would have to pick one strategy or the other. I saw this WotC card as being an example. Not a super-strategy in one card. Those are doomed by cards that dismantle decks.
True, alternate versions would do this, but we only get to create 1 card, so I suppose if it is a Jake then it would provide an alternative strategy to Jake discard, but if it is any of the other personnel it would still be useable with Jake.
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By shagg08 (Michael O'Shogay)
 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
#40234
I know we're not to that step yet. But I think the only way we can create a card that would have a similar impact as TN Jake Sisko would have to be a personnel, mission, or headquarters. Just because an interrupt would net you 1 use and then it's gone(granted you can have 3 in a deck) and events are just too easy to get rid of these days. I think everyone of these choices has interesting opportunities.
 
By Foreman
 - Gamma Quadrant
 -  
#40235
I'm starting to think that maybe the increasing of decay might be a good option. I would increase the length of time that Reclaim Terok Nor is out, which would increase the consistancy of using non- [TN] [Car] and [Dom] personnel in the deck.

I am wondering though if the problem with RTN is that it decays, or if it is because as event it can easily be destroyed by the opponent.

What if instead of increasing the length of the decay event we went another route, and protected the decay events from your opponent. (They are going to decay eventually after all).
The benifit of our card could be
"Cards your opponent owns may not destroy your decay events"
This would protect RTN, and at the same time encourage a new strategy of using other decay events too.

The thematic thing I like about this is that it takes the DS9 theme of "protect our stuff, and gives it a twist. This makes sense for [TN] since it is still the same station.


Here's a list of the decay events it could protect that would benifit the [TN].
Cardassian Protectorate- Lets do some Terok Nor mining.

Gatherer's Raid - Throw in some gatherers for some Crime fun.

Spreading Fear - Some engagement goodness.

Reclaim Terok Nor - More personnel choices

The New Occupation - Don't play dissidents, just use them for attribute bonuses

The Plays the Thing - Hmm some tampering with time?

The Reckoning - combine [TN] Kira or [TN] Odo with some pah wraith or prophet cards.

If you really wanted to the card could increase the day as well, something like.
"Order - destroy this event to place a card on your decay event into owners hand."
 
By whampiri
 - Beta Quadrant
 -  
#40247
not a bad idea foreman, the only problem being that this would have to be a personnels ability as events are too easy to destroy in the current meta.

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