Discuss all of your questions, concerns, comments and ideas about Second Edition.
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By Armus (Brian Sykes)
 - The Center of the Galaxy
 -  
Regent
Community Contributor
#424464
When will my favorite card from the set and my most fun card from the set be revealed? :wink:

I'm not exactly sure to which ones you refer, but I *think* you mean the ones for the 23rd and the 24th. -NM
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By Iron Prime (Dan Van Kampen)
 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
Moderator
#424639
1E straying in to 2E Land, so my questions may not be the best. The preview cards and articles have caught my eye, but:
So far 5 of the 18 cards have been Cardassian - was there concern during development about being too heavy in one affiliation/group? I realize it's a DS9 Anniversary set, so not much for Delta Quadrant or the like obviously, but was it discussed? (So far I like the cards, and I enjoy the Cardassians, so no grumbles, just curious)

Yes, it was absolutely a concern. We had a goal of spreading the love across as many headquarters as possible. Although Dukat and the Naprem can be used at Cardassia Prime and Deep Space 9, they are designed with Terok Nor in mind as their primary home. We decided it was okay to give one affiliation two ship/commander pairs as long as they were meant for different HQs. We still almost cut Elim Garak just to cut down on the number of [Car] cards, but I'm glad we didn't because he helps tie together the Dissidents. -NM

Nathan is absolutely correct. When we pitched this set, we had three overarching design goals in mind: cover each of the seven seasons of DS9, cover as many affiliations and factions that were featured in DS9 as possible, and highlight major moments and fan-favorite characters. When I look over the set, just of the cards that have spoiled so far, we've hit everything but Season 1 and we've got everyone but [Baj], non- [Maq] [Fed] [DS9], [Kli], and [NA] represented so far, and when I look over what's left, I see Season 1 and three of those four covered in the remaining cards. So, I think we managed to select cards that met our goal.

There's also a lot Nathan and I both loved that ended up on the "cutting room floor" so to speak - card ideas that either never quite came together, playtesters just didn't warm to quite as much, or cards that we ultimately felt didn't make the cut into the top 18. Among my favorites of the cards that didn't make the cut, and that I'd love a chance to take another crack at down the line, were a cycle of [Fed] [E] cards of the AR-558 personnel - which to the best of my knowledge don't yet exist in 1e or 2e. So, our original pitch file had a great deal of diversity.

I think Nathan and I spent a two or three months researching and working up about 40 or so draft cards, 29 of which went to playtesting at some point in order to give us the final 18. In the end, the cards that got produced were the cards that were most well-received by testers and designers and still met our stated design goals, and it just so happened that three [Car] personnel and 2 [Car] ships were among them. -MS
 
 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
Community Contributor
#424655
Two comments and a question.

Out of the 5 ships in this set revealed thus far, 4 of them are "off-colour" designs, (a [Car] K'Vort, a [Car] Attack Ship, a [Dom] Negh'Var and a [Fed] Attack Ship.) Only the [Rom] D'Deridex Advanced is more of a typical hue, and even that has a [Rom] Cardassian in command.

Also I'm pretty happy to see more native Star Power in their commanders. They generally aren't just another version of a (generally [Fed] ) Main Character with a different border. I'm a big fan of developing the "Stars" of other affiliations, who may have only appeared in a handful, or even one episode, but who are basically the "heroes of another story," over just giving them all their own Picard, Sisko etc.

And to make these questions. Were these both intentional design choices, or a coincidence? :D

We had a stated goal of showcasing important and memorable moments throughout the series. While we did not specifically look for "off-color" ships, they often make for memorable stories. We did purposefully avoid just sticking the "bridge crew" characters in other affiliations, though. We felt the expansion should represent the series, not just the station. -NM

Part of what attracted me to DS9 as a fan and as a designer was that the series pushed limits. It was darker than any Trek before it - and perhaps since. It put characters into uncomfortable and morally hazardous situations. There was war, intrigue, and espionage. In that environment ships and loyalties often changed hands. When the final draft started to take shape, I found it fascinating that so many of the ship cards that made the cut represented the "shifting loyalties" aspect of DS9, even if you won't see too many more "off-color" personnel. -MS

EDIT: Thanks. I think that translates well to the set. These cards certainly are memorable. :D

Thanks. I think I can speak for both of us when I say I hope they also prove to be as fun and playable as we think they will be. Cheers! :cheersL: -MS

All the Best,

Mattgomery Scott.
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Chief Programmer
By eberlems
 - Chief Programmer
 -  
Explorer
2E European Continental Quarter-Finalist 2023
2E  National Second Runner-Up 2023
#424722
May I snatch away an "a" from Quark before "download" and keep it?
Was there another reason not to stick with the "you may meet * requirements using ** instead." syntax aside from limiting it to [TN] personnel?

Hopefully we can get that extra "a" fixed soon. As for the gametext ability, we didn't want the ability to apply to Quark himself, but only to those [TN] personnel present with him. -MS

What he said. -NM
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By Danny (Daniel Giddings)
 - Gamma Quadrant
 -  
2E British National Runner-Up 2021
#424747
Odd question, but was Quark's download text designed to dissuade players from using this personae in a Ferenginar +1HQ deck?

No. Cards like Jean Luc Picard, "Hero of Maxia" or Farek, Distrusting Doctor or Kazago, First Officer don't care what kind of card is beneath your Ferenginar. Plus, there's no reason to assume that design won't ever revisit the Ferengo exchange mechanic, like the one found on Ishka, Moogie. -MS

Quark is definitely geared towards Terok Nor, but his ability is designed to fit with his download to Ferenginar brand without giving Terok Nor a blanket download any card. Only Cardassians and Dominion have enough [TN] personnel to really use his ability anyway, so if you want him there I would recommend Interstellar Treaty over dual HQ. -NM
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By KillerB (John Corbett)
 - The Center of the Galaxy
 -  
Continuing Committee Member - Retired
Architect
Community Contributor
#424771
KillerB wrote:I will spoiling the remaining cards on Section 31 tonight.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ul1ek-gI82Q

I agree, that 2e is in good shape. I also agree that we do need playtesters, and would reiterate that testers have a real say in the production process. So, if you think designers are getting things wrong, or if you'd just like to contribute your time and efforts to the survival of the game we all love, then please consider being a tester.

Thanks for going on the show and promoting the set. Though, I would clarify that Quark's gametext ability does not apply to himself, only to [TN] personnel with him. -MS
 
By karonofborg13 (Matthew Hayes)
 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
Architect
#424826
KillerB wrote:
KillerB wrote:I will spoiling the remaining cards on Section 31 tonight.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ul1ek-gI82Q

I agree, that 2e is in good shape. I also agree that we do need playtesters, and would reiterate that testers have a real say in the production process. So, if you think designers are getting things wrong, or if you'd just like to contribute your time and efforts to the survival of the game we all love, then please consider being a tester.

Thanks for going on the show and promoting the set. Though, I would clarify that Quark's gametext ability does not apply to himself, only to [TN] personnel with him. -MS
Just finished watching this podcast, and didn't get to see the Picard, the D, the Odo, nor the Darvin. Usually, a spoiler means a full image (like the Damar was), otherwise it's a teaser being referenced. What gives? :(
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By KillerB (John Corbett)
 - The Center of the Galaxy
 -  
Continuing Committee Member - Retired
Architect
Community Contributor
#424827
karonofborg13 wrote:
Just finished watching this podcast, and didn't get to see the Picard, the D, the Odo, nor the Darvin. Usually, a spoiler means a full image, otherwise it's a teaser being referenced. What gives? :(
I had the cards written down and I was going to read them off, but then Dan was wrapping up the show and I couldn't get into them. Sorry for the Al Capone Vault of Spoilers.

Next time ill leak them to Dan and he can put them up.
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Second Edition Playtest Manager
By Faithful Reader (Ross Fertel)
 - Second Edition Playtest Manager
 -  
Continuing Committee Member - Retired
#424952
MrCub21 wrote:Fun card for sure, I'd love to hear from design on the 7 strength though :P :D, No 120+ year old tiny Klingonish person is going to take down Sisko in a fight. :cheersL: :cheersR:
For most of testing he had 6 Strength. Towards the end he needed a little bump to get a nice even 3 cost, and boosting his Strength to 7 did the trick. We figured even if he appears human he's still a Klingon, so a 7 isn't too crazy for him. -NM

For tonight's card, there is a card in the cut file with the following text. I know Mike has an article coming, but how would you compare it to your version?
If this personnel is present with three [Pa] personnel, you may return him to his owner's hand to make an opponent name an affiliation. That opponent must return a named personnel of another affiliation to his or her hand.
Well, the soon to be revealed personnel does involve returning something to someone's hand. -MS

Ah, yes, I remember testing that version. We found that players would name something they didn't have (Hirogen was my affiliation of choice, though the question came up as to if I had to name one which actually exists in 2E) and return a personnel with a nice "when you play" effect. As a result, the order was not only unreliable, but often detrimental. The version which will be revealed soon is much less complicated and in a sense almost does the exact opposite thing. -NM

If people spit coffee on their screens Friday morning, will you reimburse them?

I cannot be held responsible for what goes in or comes out of anyone's mouth but my own. Plus, I'm a graduate student, so that's a no on the reimbursement. ;-) -MS

I'll have already spent too much money at MomoCon, so I won't be able to reimburse anybody for anything. -NM
 
By harry696
 - Beta Quadrant
 -  
#424989
Why is Odo (card 44V2) classified as being a HUMAN instead of a CHANGELING as in the personae versions?

In the final episode of season 4, Broken Link, the Founders lock Odo into a human shape. Bashir tests him and says "Physiologically, you're completely human." While he does regain his shape-shifting abilities later, he's still human in Trials and Tribble-ations. We actually hoped to make his species "Solid," but we confirmed with the script and dialogue that he was completely human (except for his face). -NM

From the transcript of Borken Link:

SISKO: Doctor.
(The sea is churning. Odo is tossed around then dumped naked onto the atoll.)
SISKO: Odo, are you all right?
BASHIR: Captain, I'm getting some strange readings.
SISKO: What have you done to him?
FOUNDER: He has been judged.
BASHIR: Captain, I'm reading a heart, lungs, and a digestive system. It's as if he were human.
FOUNDER: We gave him what he wanted. We made him a solid. He's one of you now. Oh, poor Odo. Perhaps we should have killed you. It would have been far less cruel. He's yours. Take him and go.
SISKO: Sisko to Defiant.
DAX [OC]: Go ahead, Captain.
SISKO: Three to beam up.
[Medical bay]
(Bashir takes a blood sample from Odo.)
ODO: Staring at it isn't going to make it change shape.
BASHIR: It's blood, all right. Not a trace of changeling protoplasm in your entire system. Type O negative, if you were wondering.
ODO: I'll be sure to remember that.
BASHIR: Physiologically, you're completely human.

This is also why his Strength has been reduced to 6. -MS
 
 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
Community Contributor
#424993
harry696 wrote:Why is Odo (card 44V2) classified as being a HUMAN instead of a CHANGELING as in the personae versions?
As I recall, this was at the point where the Founders had taken away his ability to shapeshift as punishment for him breaking their most sacred rule. So at this point he basically was human.

EDIT: And a designer beat me to it. :shifty:

All the Best,

Mattgomery Scott.
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Second Edition Playtest Manager
By Faithful Reader (Ross Fertel)
 - Second Edition Playtest Manager
 -  
Continuing Committee Member - Retired
#425017
eberlems wrote:May I snatch away an "a" from Quark before "download" and keep it?
Was there another reason not to stick with the "you may meet * requirements using ** instead." syntax aside from limiting it to [TN] personnel?

Hopefully we can get that extra "a" fixed soon. As for the gametext ability, we didn't want the ability to apply to Quark himself, but only to those [TN] personnel present with him. -MS

What he said. -NM
We will have the a fixed. Sorry our slip is showing, but this is one of those things that literally no one caught. Art and Programming will get on it.
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By Cmdr Xym (Joseph Bazemore)
 - Beta Quadrant
 -  
#425049
Faithful Reader wrote:We will have the a fixed. Sorry our slip is showing, but this is one of those things that literally no one caught. Art and Programming will get on it.
Oops. :shifty:

Indeed. - MS
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