Discuss all of your questions, concerns, comments and ideas about Second Edition.
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European OP Coordinator
 - European OP Coordinator
 -  
#564241
Bio-ship Attack

It seems absolutely clear to me, that if you repair a ship damaged by that dilemma, that dilemma is placed in your core instead of being returned to your opponent's dilemma pile.

What happens, if the ship is destroyed? Are the damage markers also "removed", so this one goes in your core? I'd say yes...

:cheersL: :cheersL: :cheersL: :borg: :cheersR: :cheersR: :cheersR:
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By Gorgo Primus (Benjamin Rostoker)
 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
#564244
So far as I know, it is only removed if something says it is removed - which includes repairing, as the rulebook explicitly says to 'remove' it when doing so. So ship destruction wouldn't count as the card isn't removed but discarded by default when the ship explodes, whereas repairing at HQ or using one of the many personnel, events, etc that says to remove a damage card would.

Again, so far as I know.
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By Armus (Brian Sykes)
 - The Center of the Galaxy
 -  
Regent
Community Contributor
#564247
JeBuS wrote: Wed Oct 13, 2021 3:54 pm The rules say "When ... that ship is destroyed, and all cards on that ship are placed in their owners’ discard piles"
Yeah but typically dilemmas return to their owners' dilemma pile.
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By Armus (Brian Sykes)
 - The Center of the Galaxy
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Regent
Community Contributor
#564258
Gorgo Primus wrote: Wed Oct 13, 2021 3:54 pm So far as I know, it is only removed if something says it is removed - which includes repairing, as the rulebook explicitly says to 'remove' it when doing so. So ship destruction wouldn't count as the card isn't removed but discarded by default when the ship explodes, whereas repairing at HQ or using one of the many personnel, events, etc that says to remove a damage card would.

Again, so far as I know.
Did you run that theory past rules before releasing a card that is dependent on it?

Because to me, if you blow up the ship, you remove the dilemma before it hits the discard pile and redirect it to core vice dilemma pile.

At the very least it's a bit ambiguous and could do with an official clarification.
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By Danny (Daniel Giddings)
 - Gamma Quadrant
 -  
2E British National Runner-Up 2021
#564291
Armus wrote: Wed Oct 13, 2021 5:14 pmDid you run that theory past rules before releasing a card that is dependent on it?

No, we didn't, but not through negligence, but rather (potentially misguided) certainty - it was my firm understanding (based on the lines quoted from the rulebook) that the dilemma would return to the pile if the ship was destroyed.

That said, official clarification is always welcome :thumbsup:
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Second Edition Design Manager
By The Guardian (Richard New)
 - Second Edition Design Manager
 -  
2E North American Continental Quarter-Finalist 2023
#564322
Danny wrote: Thu Oct 14, 2021 2:44 am
Did you run that theory past rules before releasing a card that is dependent on it?
No, we didn't, but...
I do remember a conversation about this subject. And I do see in the logs that we put a note in for Rules to make sure it worked as discussed then and here. They later greenlit it.
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By Armus (Brian Sykes)
 - The Center of the Galaxy
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Regent
Community Contributor
#564324
Ok so just so I'm clear, Rules (@Marquetry ) has said that the only time a damage marker gets "removed" from a ship is when that ship is repaired (or presumably when a card says "remove a damage marker" or similar?)?

Which means you *don't* "remove" damage markers when the ship goes boom?

Am I understanding all of that correctly?
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By Danny (Daniel Giddings)
 - Gamma Quadrant
 -  
2E British National Runner-Up 2021
#564325
The Guardian wrote: Thu Oct 14, 2021 2:34 pmI do remember a conversation about this subject. And I do see in the logs that we put a note in for Rules to make sure it worked as discussed then and here. They later greenlit it.

Huh. That'd escaped me. Good to know my confidence was based on something I'd forgotten, rather than my usual "unjustified sureness".
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By Danny (Daniel Giddings)
 - Gamma Quadrant
 -  
2E British National Runner-Up 2021
#564326
Armus wrote: Thu Oct 14, 2021 3:08 pmWhich means you *don't* "remove" damage markers when the ship goes boom?

I guess it's similar to the personnel aboard said exploding ship not being "killed" in the strictest sense of the word.
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Ambassador
 - Ambassador
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#564332
Danny wrote: Thu Oct 14, 2021 3:11 pm
Armus wrote: Thu Oct 14, 2021 3:08 pmWhich means you *don't* "remove" damage markers when the ship goes boom?

I guess it's similar to the personnel aboard said exploding ship not being "killed" in the strictest sense of the word.
Umsaywhatnow?? Personell on an exploding ship don't get killed?!?
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By Armus (Brian Sykes)
 - The Center of the Galaxy
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Regent
Community Contributor
#564333
Fritzinger wrote: Thu Oct 14, 2021 4:20 pm
Danny wrote: Thu Oct 14, 2021 3:11 pm
Armus wrote: Thu Oct 14, 2021 3:08 pmWhich means you *don't* "remove" damage markers when the ship goes boom?

I guess it's similar to the personnel aboard said exploding ship not being "killed" in the strictest sense of the word.
Umsaywhatnow?? Personell on an exploding ship don't get killed?!?
Nope. They get placed in the discard pile.

It's in the rulebook.
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By Marquetry
 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
Continuing Committee Member - Retired
2E North American Continental Quarter-Finalist 2023
#564366
Danny wrote: Thu Oct 14, 2021 3:09 pm
The Guardian wrote: Thu Oct 14, 2021 2:34 pmI do remember a conversation about this subject. And I do see in the logs that we put a note in for Rules to make sure it worked as discussed then and here. They later greenlit it.

Huh. That'd escaped me. Good to know my confidence was based on something I'd forgotten, rather than my usual "unjustified sureness".
It's okay, I don't remember it either!
But damage is "Removed" by the end of turn repairing, or all the cards that say removed. When a ship is destroyed, they are placed in the discard pile (or returned to dilemma pile); as was mentioned above, same sort of thing as personnel being killed or played being different than being placed somewhere.
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