By Winner of Borg (Stefan Slaby)
 - Beta Quadrant
 -  
Continuing Committee Member - Retired
1E European Continental Champion 2023
1E Austrian National Champion 2023
2E Austrian National Champion 2022
1E Borg Region Regional Champion 2023
2E Borg Region Regional Champion 2023
#459228
hi guys,

we've had the first week of regionals, yet this year's earned byes list is still empty. when will they start showing?

(i'm actually trying to find out whether i still have earned byes from last december's nationals before deciding how serious to take the upcoming regionals / nationals... i seem to recall there was some controversy around too many earned byes being awarded, but i can't remember the outcome.)

Steven
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Executive Officer
By jadziadax8 (Maggie Geppert)
 - Executive Officer
 -  
2E North American Continental Semi-Finalist 2023
ibbles  Trek Masters Tribbles Champion 2023
2E Deep Space 9 Regional Champion 2023
#459232
I will check on that.
User avatar
 
By Armus (Brian Sykes)
 - The Center of the Galaxy
 -  
Regent
Community Contributor
#459234
Winner of Borg wrote:hi guys,

we've had the first week of regionals, yet this year's earned byes list is still empty. when will they start showing?

(i'm actually trying to find out whether i still have earned byes from last december's nationals before deciding how serious to take the upcoming regionals / nationals... i seem to recall there was some controversy around too many earned byes being awarded, but i can't remember the outcome.)

Steven
I hope you're taking it seriously enough to crown an empress of the Dominion this year... :D
User avatar
Executive Officer
By jadziadax8 (Maggie Geppert)
 - Executive Officer
 -  
2E North American Continental Semi-Finalist 2023
ibbles  Trek Masters Tribbles Champion 2023
2E Deep Space 9 Regional Champion 2023
#459252
The page is now update.

Holy crap, I've got a Round 1 Bye for Worlds this year!
 
By Winner of Borg (Stefan Slaby)
 - Beta Quadrant
 -  
Continuing Committee Member - Retired
1E European Continental Champion 2023
1E Austrian National Champion 2023
2E Austrian National Champion 2022
1E Borg Region Regional Champion 2023
2E Borg Region Regional Champion 2023
#459275
thanks!
Armus wrote:I hope you're taking it seriously enough to crown an empress of the Dominion this year... :D
you want royal jelly? go for it, i've got different plans :)
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First Edition Creative Manager
By KazonPADD (Paddy Tye)
 - First Edition Creative Manager
 -  
1E European Continental Runner-Up 2023
1E The Neutral Zone Regional Champion 2023
#459334
Why does Meinhard have 2 byes for Euro-continentals? Should his one from British Nationals not be passed down to Jorn (next highest ranked player without a bye)?
User avatar
 
By nobthehobbit (Daniel Pareja)
 - The Center of the Galaxy
 -  
Moderator
#459335
KazonPADD wrote:Why does Meinhard have 2 byes for Euro-continentals? Should his one from British Nationals not be passed down to Jorn (next highest ranked player without a bye)?
To be quite honest, I don't think byes should pass down. Why should someone who finishes outside of a place that would normally get an earned bye get one anyway just because they happened to play an event later in the competitive year? Why not just let them stack, to a maximum of two, and let further byes earned be lost?
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By Marquetry
 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
Continuing Committee Member - Retired
2E North American Continental Quarter-Finalist 2023
#459336
Sounds like a vote for after this competitive season :)

I had to be reminded last weekend that I have a 1st-round Bye at worlds.. and had also forgotten about the Tribbles headstart! ahahah, not used to that.
 
By Winner of Borg (Stefan Slaby)
 - Beta Quadrant
 -  
Continuing Committee Member - Retired
1E European Continental Champion 2023
1E Austrian National Champion 2023
2E Austrian National Champion 2022
1E Borg Region Regional Champion 2023
2E Borg Region Regional Champion 2023
#459358
the point of the pass down is to allow players who have already earned their byes to play the rest of the regionals without throwing games in order to not ruin the bye for somebody else.

that being said, i don't think there should be a pass down in Meinhard's case, his second bye is from reaching 60 masters points, which cannot be passed to anybody else. (although he did pass 60 masters points by winning that very same national that gave him the first bye... so i guess an edge case might be argued?)
User avatar
 
By nobthehobbit (Daniel Pareja)
 - The Center of the Galaxy
 -  
Moderator
#459385
Winner of Borg wrote:the point of the pass down is to allow players who have already earned their byes to play the rest of the regionals without throwing games in order to not ruin the bye for somebody else.

that being said, i don't think there should be a pass down in Meinhard's case, his second bye is from reaching 60 masters points, which cannot be passed to anybody else. (although he did pass 60 masters points by winning that very same national that gave him the first bye... so i guess an edge case might be argued?)
Yes, but my point is, why should later events be privileged in this way?
 
By Winner of Borg (Stefan Slaby)
 - Beta Quadrant
 -  
Continuing Committee Member - Retired
1E European Continental Champion 2023
1E Austrian National Champion 2023
2E Austrian National Champion 2022
1E Borg Region Regional Champion 2023
2E Borg Region Regional Champion 2023
#459421
nobthehobbit wrote:Yes, but my point is, why should later events be privileged in this way?
because of... linear time? :)

earned byes stacking is not a good idea, that would put pressure on top players to get the maximum number of earned byes instead of just one, and make the whole regional season more unpleasant. i can tell you for a fact that i'm enjoying regionals more after i've already earned my byes.

and in any scenario where earned byes would be "lost" by the wrong player winning, in my opinion, without a legal way of passing down earned byes many players (and TDs) would simply resort to less legal means - manipulating tournament results through deliberate losses, dropping out of the tournament on paper (while still playing), or completely misreporting results to have the pass-down-target "win" on paper. i wouldn't blame them.
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Ambassador
By T-Ricks (Rick Kinney)
 - Ambassador
 -  
#459634
nobthehobbit wrote:
KazonPADD wrote:Why does Meinhard have 2 byes for Euro-continentals? Should his one from British Nationals not be passed down to Jorn (next highest ranked player without a bye)?
To be quite honest, I don't think byes should pass down. Why should someone who finishes outside of a place that would normally get an earned bye get one anyway just because they happened to play an event later in the competitive year? Why not just let them stack, to a maximum of two, and let further byes earned be lost?
One argument for passing down byes could be, if an area has a dominant player, the other players would only have a very slim chance to win a bye. Not much motivation to play if you know it doesn't matter what you do because the dominant player will usually take first place.
User avatar
 
By DarkSabre (Austin Chandler)
 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
Continuing Committee Member - Retired
#459666
T-Ricks wrote:
nobthehobbit wrote:
KazonPADD wrote:Why does Meinhard have 2 byes for Euro-continentals? Should his one from British Nationals not be passed down to Jorn (next highest ranked player without a bye)?
To be quite honest, I don't think byes should pass down. Why should someone who finishes outside of a place that would normally get an earned bye get one anyway just because they happened to play an event later in the competitive year? Why not just let them stack, to a maximum of two, and let further byes earned be lost?
One argument for passing down byes could be, if an area has a dominant player, the other players would only have a very slim chance to win a bye. Not much motivation to play if you know it doesn't matter what you do because the dominant player will usually take first place.

:thumbsup:
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By nobthehobbit (Daniel Pareja)
 - The Center of the Galaxy
 -  
Moderator
#459673
One potential remedy: Tally up the number of byes lost due to ending pass-downs and hand them out to the best non-recipients at the end of Regional season. How "best" is measured would, of course, have to be determined by some method, probably something akin to Masters Points, only for Regionals and Nationals instead of Nationals and Masters, and probably with a different allocation formula.
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Director of Organized Play
By LORE (Kris Sonsteby)
 - Director of Organized Play
 -  
Architect
1E Andoria Regional Champion 2023
2E Andoria Regional Champion 2023
W.C.T. Chairman's Trophy winner 2014-2015
#459675
FYI, byes are currently under review and will likely end up as some component of the reward store. Details are still being fleshed out, but the thought is players will receive points for winning a Regional equivalent to the "cost" of a Bye. They can either redeem them for a Bye, or if they are not continuing along the Road to Worlds and participating in the Continental Championships, they can redeem them for something else. Conversely, players whom have earned points can purchase a Continental Bye, regardless of their status as a Regional winner.

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