Home of the third annual You Make The Card contest, where the community designs a card for an upcoming Virtual Expansion!

Which direction should we choose for Harry Mudd (2E)?

A) The Slippery Weasel
15
22%
B) The Commodities Trader
26
38%
C) The Lady Killer
15
22%
D) The Jack-of-all-Trades Rogue
11
16%
E) None of the Above (Please post why!)
1
1%
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By mindmage (Ben Johnson)
 - Beta Quadrant
 -  
#179663
I saw nothing wrong with his original version. Did anyone think of 'remove him from game' when you do his ability, or 'shuffle him back into your deck' so the TOS guy can't grab him from the bottom of your deck back into your hand?
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By Maelwys (Chris Lobban)
 - Gamma Quadrant
 -  
Community Contributor
#179669
mindmage wrote:I saw nothing wrong with his original version. Did anyone think of 'remove him from game' when you do his ability, or 'shuffle him back into your deck' so the TOS guy can't grab him from the bottom of your deck back into your hand?
I often see nothing wrong with my designs, but that's why we have playtesters... to find things wrong. And they found plenty of things wrong with this gametext.
In total I count 8 revisions that the gametext went through, trying to get it to work. And yet "remove him from the game" was indeed on a few of those. But it still didn't work. As a designer, one of the hardest lessons is learning when to admit defeat and walk away from gametext that you really like, because the playtesters keep telling you that it's broken. It's hard, but eventually the best way is just to throw it away and start from scratch, which is why we're doing that here now.
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By Frimmel
 - Beta Quadrant
 -  
#179677
It just seems to me that Harry's arrival is always a problem or obstacle for the crew and that something to do with commodities is going to make him a benefit. As fans watching we're happy to see Harry show up but he's a pain in the neck for Kirk and company. Harry needs the crew to save his backside. He doesn't show up to do nice things for the crew.
Second Edition Creative Manager
By Triumph (Jonathan)
 - Second Edition Creative Manager
 -  
Adventurer
#179680
There are still more total votes for Not-Commodities-Harry than for Commodities-Harry. But they are split up among three options. Any chance of people (who may want more Commodities love in 2E, just not on Harry) coming together around one alternative?
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First Edition Creative Manager
By KazonPADD (Paddy Tye)
 - First Edition Creative Manager
 -  
1E European Continental Runner-Up 2023
1E The Neutral Zone Regional Champion 2023
#179684
Triumph wrote:There are still more total votes for Not-Commodities-Harry than for Commodities-Harry. But they are split up among three options. Any chance of people (who may want more Commodities love in 2E, just not on Harry) coming together around one alternative?
Sounds like you're suggesting some sort of vote-rigging malarky to me!
:shifty:

Just because commodities wasn't people's first choice, it doesn't follow that they are completely anti-commodities!
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By GooeyChewie (Nathan Miracle)
 - Gamma Quadrant
 -  
Continuing Committee Member - Retired
Architect
#179685
KazonPADD wrote:Just because commodities wasn't people's first choice, it doesn't follow that they are completely anti-commodities!
+1

I think there's more room for creativity in "Lady Killer," but that doesn't mean I'd be disappointed by a Commodities Mudd.
Second Edition Creative Manager
By Triumph (Jonathan)
 - Second Edition Creative Manager
 -  
Adventurer
#179687
LOL, well, I actually am anti-Commodities-Harry. I certainly want more Commodities love for the game, but I really don't think it should be on Mudd. Despite his claims to be a "legitimate businessman," he was really nothing like Gint or Quark or Hanok in terms of engaging in business and trading. So I like all of the other options better. If there are others like me whose first choice is not winning, and whose second choice is not option 2, maybe we'd rather vote for a second choice than have commodities win. Just my :twocents: , perfecty legal, the name's Leo Walsh...
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By Maelwys (Chris Lobban)
 - Gamma Quadrant
 -  
Community Contributor
#179688
KazonPADD wrote:
Triumph wrote:There are still more total votes for Not-Commodities-Harry than for Commodities-Harry. But they are split up among three options. Any chance of people (who may want more Commodities love in 2E, just not on Harry) coming together around one alternative?
Sounds like you're suggesting some sort of vote-rigging malarky to me!
:shifty:
Not really. It's more like he's suggesting a multiple-option voting system, which is way better than a first-past-the-post system. As he pointed out, just because Commodities has a plurality (more votes than any other option) doesn't mean it has a majority (more than 50% votes). Because people can change their votes, people who voted for any of the minority options that aren't likely to win at this point can still make their votes heard by voting for their second-favourite option. So given that "Jack-of-all-Trades Rogue" is the least favourable option (not counting "none of the above"), people with that vote can now choose to accept surrender and move their votes to something else. Then the next lowest option (after those votes have been distributed) can move their votes somewhere else, until we have a clear majority. It might be that all of those voters are "anti Commodities" and all move their votes into the same other option, which beats out the Commodities option for the majority. Or it might be that some of those people liked Commodities as their second (or third) best option and move their votes there, cementing its majority.
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First Edition Creative Manager
By KazonPADD (Paddy Tye)
 - First Edition Creative Manager
 -  
1E European Continental Runner-Up 2023
1E The Neutral Zone Regional Champion 2023
#179701
Oh I'm all in favour of the single transferable vote. But it did sound like "Come on guys, the Chinese are winning all the gold medals, let's club together and then we would have more instead". I know it wasn't though!

If you want to redesign our polling system on here, I'd be all in favour. I know for the original WotC3 vote I did move my vote around based on the results.
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By Smiley (Cristoffer Wiker)
 - Gamma Quadrant
 -  
Continuing Committee Member - Retired
#179702
Agreeing with K-pad. I think the system would benefit from a hidden score until it is finished. This way everyone can choose and re-choose all the way to closing time but as they can's see the outcome more then maybe the amount of participants you have a better way of coming to a fair and more accurate view of what the players and participants think/want and so on.
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By nobthehobbit (Daniel Pareja)
 - The Center of the Galaxy
 -  
Moderator
#179705
Why not do these polls by approval voting? I'd personally rather use Borda, but I don't know if the site's polling can do that, and I know it can do approval.
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By gtdoug
 - Alpha Quadrant
 -  
#179745
I'm not a fan of 'commodities' for Harry...

I would prefer to see those on Ferengi / Dosi cards.

I like this idea alot :
I had voted for Commodities, but I changed my vote to "Lady Killer." I think it'd be fun if he somehow forced dilemmas to do extra random selections, which would increase your chances of having the appropriate personnel be randomly selected for Mudd's Women (or Ba'el, Naive Prisoner, or Chalan Aroya, Accessible Restauranteur, or Jadzia Dax, Soldier of Fortune, or any of several Leetas, or M'Pella, Seductive Employee, or Sakonna, Puzzled Interrogator... you may notice a theme there).
Okay...

It doesn't have to be exactly that...

BUT... some way to download Mudd's Women and then 'influence' the random selections in some way would fit with Harry's "mail order bride" persona quite well.

:)

Doug
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Second Edition Playtest Manager
By Faithful Reader (Ross Fertel)
 - Second Edition Playtest Manager
 -  
Continuing Committee Member - Retired
#179752
After the fist couple of days for voting, things don't tend to change in a huge dramaic fashion 'round these parts. I'm wondering if those that voted for commodities will use them in Harry does wind up with that sort of skill.
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By bhosp
 - Gamma Quadrant
 -  
#179761
Maybe he should steal back your Commodities (so you can sell them again?) Maybe he trades your opponent another of your events to get a commodity back (i.e., here, you can have this Party Atmosphere so I can have my Felicium back).
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