[DarkSabre]

Mod Edit [Boffo97]: Split off from the topic Dilemma "bug out" rule as a tangent.

It's buried in Dilemma Resolution - Targets:

Targets – The targets of a dilemma include
the cards it affects (e.g., personnel selected
to die), a personnel, ship, or facility that the
dilemma is placed on, or a target destination
for a relocation. Targets may be chosen by
random selection, opponent’s choice, or
owner’s choice. When a dilemma specifies a
superlative such as “strongest,” “most
CUNNING,” or “highest total attributes,” and
there is a tie, the opponent of the player
encountering the dilemma gets to choose. If
no personnel remain to be targeted by a
dilemma just encountered, because you
used game text that allows you to remove
them, replace that dilemma under the
mission (the mission attempt ends). For
example, Elim Garak (“May avoid any
random selection”) encounters Armus – Skin
of Evil. If you choose to have Elim Garak
avoid the random selection, there is no one
left to be targeted by Armus, and it is
replaced under the mission. Another card
that might remove all personnel before you
can resolve a dilemma is Flight of the
Intruder.

Of course, when the Revolution comes and s stop working during dilemmas unless they are valid responses (killing this trick and the dumb Kes trick and the dumb Nilz Baris trick...), this will be much less of a bother.

Viva la Revolucion! Hasta la victoria siempre!

Yeah that would negate the entire MACO playbook




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[BCSWowbagger]

Of course, when the Revolution comes and s stop working during dilemmas unless they are valid responses (killing this trick and the dumb Kes trick and the dumb Nilz Baris trick...), this will be much less of a bother.

Viva la Revolucion! Hasta la victoria siempre!

Yeah that would negate the entire MACO playbook

Not sure if you think that's a good thing or a bad thing, but... it would force them to plan ahead.

Actually, that download on MACO Amanda Cole is a pretty good argument for this change. If you draw Combat-Ready: Jury-Rig and have it in your hand, ready to go, when her crew encounters The Cloud, you can't use it, because it's not a valid response. But you CAN use it if Amanda Cole is there and uses her , because does not give a darn about any timing rules anywhere. You can gain that extra ENGINEER you need to save the ship from being damaged and double-stopped, all because you didn't stock the card normally.

That's goofy. The game should reward you for drawing interrupts when you need them, not punish you for stocking them anywhere other than your Tent.

[bhosp]

That’s why it’s good that Cold Warriors says “plays while facing a dilemma.”

[BCSWowbagger]

That’s why it’s good that Cold Warriors says “plays while facing a dilemma.”

Very true. Which makes Chang's of it a valid response, which means it will still work under the Glorious New Regime.

(To be clear: this change is not actually in process, and it would require a huge amount of research plus some testing... but, if there were community support for exploring a change to DL timing, the wheels could start turning.)

[Armus]

If you ever want to credibly get rid of Containment Field then this is one way you could plausibly do it.

I'm not sure that juice is worth the squeeze, but I also don't have the same hate-on for cards as some other members of the community.

[AllenGould]

It would certainly be worth reworking to not be a Super Magical SuperPower ability.

[DarkSabre]

It would certainly be worth reworking to not be a Super Magical SuperPower ability.

Won’t happen because it’ll severely weaken 22nd century


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[AllenGould]

It would certainly be worth reworking to not be a Super Magical SuperPower ability.

Won’t happen because it’ll severely weaken 22nd century

Aren't they top of the heap right now? Seems like the perfect time to fix it.

[DarkSabre]

It would certainly be worth reworking to not be a Super Magical SuperPower ability.

Won’t happen because it’ll severely weaken 22nd century

Aren't they top of the heap right now? Seems like the perfect time to fix it.

Won’t happen. They have been top of the heap for over a year and been given some bruises but nothing to actually stop them from being more powerful than any other deck type in the game.

I could be wrong but the errata given to TB reinforces that opinion in my mind. The errata just gives more incentives for this to turn into what happened with Continuing Mission - Play 22nd if you want to win.

So a rule that would effectively gut MACO & harm Starfleet/Klingon decks? Won’t happen.

And it isn’t that rule that makes them powerful. TB is and all it would do by changing this rule would make them more usable because it would clamp down on non 22nd decks that rely on those SDs during mission attempts.

I can probably count on my fingers how many times in the last few years I have ever used a SD during dilemma encountering - but many of the players I have played against do use that ability a lot.

I think changing this rule has to be given a lot of thought and shouldn’t break the function of some personnel or cards that were designed with this rule in mind.








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[bhosp]

I can probably count on my fingers how many times in the last few years I have ever used a SD during dilemma encountering - but many of the players I have played against do use that ability a lot.

I think changing this rule has to be given a lot of thought and shouldn’t break the function of some personnel or cards that were designed with this rule in mind.

I use Daniels’s special download all the time. Him (and Ensign Jameson, but Daniels is easier to use since he’s ) are the best thing about missions with Time Locations.

Found a bunch of neural parasites behind that founder lock door? Better call Daniels.

No doctor but the plague ship is coming? Better call Daniels.

Etc.

[DarkSabre]

I can probably count on my fingers how many times in the last few years I have ever used a SD during dilemma encountering - but many of the players I have played against do use that ability a lot.

I think changing this rule has to be given a lot of thought and shouldn’t break the function of some personnel or cards that were designed with this rule in mind.

I use Daniels’s special download all the time. Him (and Ensign Jameson, but Daniels is easier to use since he’s ) are the best thing about missions with Time Locations.

Found a bunch of neural parasites behind that founder lock door? Better call Daniels.

No doctor but the plague ship is coming? Better call Daniels.

Etc.

Yes. You are one of the people I play with that uses it a lot.

It’s a useful trick and far better than dilemma manipulation in terms of NPE. Rather see you do that instead of being able to nullify my dilemma or swap out one of your dilemmas against me on the fly.




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[bhosp]

I can probably count on my fingers how many times in the last few years I have ever used a SD during dilemma encountering - but many of the players I have played against do use that ability a lot.

I think changing this rule has to be given a lot of thought and shouldn’t break the function of some personnel or cards that were designed with this rule in mind.

I use Daniels’s special download all the time. Him (and Ensign Jameson, but Daniels is easier to use since he’s ) are the best thing about missions with Time Locations.

Found a bunch of neural parasites behind that founder lock door? Better call Daniels.

No doctor but the plague ship is coming? Better call Daniels.

Etc.

Yes. You are one of the people I play with that uses it a lot.

It’s a useful trick and far better than dilemma manipulation in terms of NPE. Rather see you do that instead of being able to nullify my dilemma or swap out one of your dilemmas against me on the fly.




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Disrupted Continuum is actually a pretty good way to punish me for doing this too.

[BCSWowbagger]

It would certainly be worth reworking to not be a Super Magical SuperPower ability.

Won’t happen because it’ll severely weaken 22nd century

And it isn’t that rule that makes them powerful. TB is and all it would do by changing this rule would make them more usable because it would clamp down on non 22nd decks that rely on those SDs during mission attempts.

Hold up, there, Chief. So which is it? Would reworking the timing of "severely weaken" , or would it "make more usable"? Doesn't seem like it can be both.

[AllenGould]

Here's the problem I see with - it does too much.

It fetches a card (even from side decks)
It plays the card for free.
It ignores reporting restrictions.
It ignores timing rules.

You literally can't make another personnel/ship card ability, because by definition would do it better. (And that's assuming you could make a new loaded icon; spelling it out guarantees it'll suck *and* not fit!)

Something needs to give.

[DarkSabre]

It would certainly be worth reworking to not be a Super Magical SuperPower ability.

Won’t happen because it’ll severely weaken 22nd century

And it isn’t that rule that makes them powerful. TB is and all it would do by changing this rule would make them more usable because it would clamp down on non 22nd decks that rely on those SDs during mission attempts.

Hold up, there, Chief. So which is it? Would reworking the timing of "severely weaken" , or would it "make more usable"? Doesn't seem like it can be both.

It does when it weakens other deck designs more than 22nd so that 22nd, while already powerful, are made more enticing and powerful to use because that rule doesn’t hurt them more than it actually helps them.

While it would severely harm MACOs and hurt Starfleet and the Klingons it wouldn’t make a Vulcan/Romulan deck blink.


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