[Discovery suxs]

Erratas not being close to the same power level is bad because it is like ripping the soul out of the card.

Kazon collective was the best treaty in the game. Honestly some mega gaming players ruined the card for everyone. So it was not even a treaty anymore. My suggestion would of been may mix with 1 additional affiliation not native.

My group has never just played with the erratas only. We use both of them. So we have extra cards. I knew straight up when I saw the holo projectors errata. There was no way I would play with a card that did 4 things now does 1 thing. I'm sorry that was a terrible errata. We played my otf rules and the ban list. Last month I got hit my holographic camouflage being banned in my romulan deck. Now this month my friends khan deck is useless now. He didn't even use the eels for banning them either. So we are basically just making up our own banned list. We don't use discard cards, no ref cards, and no colony are just a few examples of our gameplay.

[Enabran]

How many people are in your group?

[Discovery suxs]

How many people are in your group?

3 mainly occasional 4. We are all former mtg players for years.

Poll was reduced to 10 days after Charlie said he was against it. It is 20 to 3 against the list. So not looking good. I don't think 20 days will make any difference over 10 days.

I will say it seems people like polls lol.

[BCSWowbagger]

I tend to think that a format should have as few complications as possible. So I think a ban list is okay, and a restricted list could be okay in theory, but I don't think a format should have both.

[Discovery suxs]

I tend to think that a format should have as few complications as possible. So I think a ban list is okay, and a restricted list could be okay in theory, but I don't think a format should have both.

Really? You do know every mtg format has both.

[BCSWowbagger]

Yes. There are a number of things I think Magic is able to do, thanks to its gigantic size and consistently strong recruitment of new players, that I think we cannot or should not do. This is one of them.

[nobthehobbit]

I tend to think that a format should have as few complications as possible. So I think a ban list is okay, and a restricted list could be okay in theory, but I don't think a format should have both.

Really? You do know every mtg format has both.

Only Vintage has a restricted list. Every other format has only a ban list. And this is precisely for the reason Charlie gave: a restricted list makes games boil down to "who draws more broken cards". (Vintage still works, kinda, because there's enough restricted broken cards, and enough countermagic, to ensure that each player draws about the same number of overly powerful cards.)

And even then, Vintage's ban list is not for cards that are too powerful, but rather for cars that literally don't work within the context of a tournament, such as Conspiracies, ante cards, physical action cards, or Shahrazad (since it invariably leads to matches going to the time limit).

[SudenKapala]

Yep, we love our polls...
I wonder who the 3rd "yes" vote was from, and what their motive was? (Assuming that Disco himself was the 1st one.)
Interesting to hear what the background is for another "yes" -- let us know.

Aside from that, you could just as well wrap up the poll right now, of course...

[DarkSabre]

I'm personally tired of mega gaming players getting cards banned forever. The erratas take forever to get them off the banned list. Most of the time the erratas are not even close to the same power level. Now after banning memory wipe and more importantly Khan's EEL too. I'm doing this poll because only doing erratas or banning cards is way too limiting for this game.

So please fill out my poll. You can change your choice btw.

Heres a small example of the restricted list.

OTF restricted list

Artifacts on restricted list must be earned and can't be played until your turn 4. The quality you can have in any decks is by the card names. The restricted list is help to level the game. While still letting you enjoy the cards in the game. The restricted list is not a replacement for banned list. It is supplement to the banned list.


List

Memory wipe (limit 3)
Ceti Eel (limit 4)
Senior Staff Meeting (limit 1)
Rogue Borg Mercenaries (limit 4)
Tox Uthat (limit 1)
Time Travel Pod (limit 1)
Sherlock Holmes (limit 1) (must have holoprogram in play)

Sounds like you should just do this for your kitchen table games.

Listen, when OTF was first announced we did our own format in NYC because heavily disagreed with OTF. OTF has gotten better but my playgroup totally disagreed. No one is forcing a group to play by certain rules in this day of the game. Yes, if you are a competitive player and want to go to Master Level & Above events then you have to accept OTF. However feel free to do almost anything for Regionals and below - just make sure you advertise it beforehand.

[Takket]

I'm personally tired of mega gaming players getting cards banned forever. The erratas take forever to get them off the banned list. Most of the time the erratas are not even close to the same power level. Now after banning memory wipe and more importantly Khan's EEL too. I'm doing this poll because only doing erratas or banning cards is way too limiting for this game.

So please fill out my poll. You can change your choice btw.

Heres a small example of the restricted list.

OTF restricted list

Artifacts on restricted list must be earned and can't be played until your turn 4. The quality you can have in any decks is by the card names. The restricted list is help to level the game. While still letting you enjoy the cards in the game. The restricted list is not a replacement for banned list. It is supplement to the banned list.


List

Memory wipe (limit 3)
Ceti Eel (limit 4)
Senior Staff Meeting (limit 1)
Rogue Borg Mercenaries (limit 4)
Tox Uthat (limit 1)
Time Travel Pod (limit 1)
Sherlock Holmes (limit 1) (must have holoprogram in play)

it might have an application in some places but not all of them. like tox Uthat.... limit one doesn't help much when all you need is one. same with senior staff meeting. nullifying a dilemma is just too powerful without any real cost, even if it is only used once.

If you aren't playing OTF in your group it seems like the difference is pretty much moot for you anyway. Try imposing the restrictions in your play group and see how it goes.

[Discovery suxs]

Yep, we love our polls...
I wonder who the 3rd "yes" vote was from, and what their motive was? (Assuming that Disco himself was the 1st one.)
Interesting to hear what the background is for another "yes" -- let us know.

Aside from that, you could just as well wrap up the poll right now, of course...

I would assume it is the person who said you can vote yes and no

[Hoss-Drone]

There's more than one kind of "restricted list". Magic and this thread subscribes to the you only get x copies of restricted cards in your deck" version. FFG games (game of thrones and destiny) use the "you can only pick one card from the restricted list to put in your deck" version.

Maybe 1e needs a latter variation? One of 1e's biggest issues was players spamming all the abusive stuff in a single deck. If you can only ever use one of them, it becomes much easier to play around.

So maybe we keep some things banned bc they are just never good (rogue Borg mercs) but many other things go on the list of pick only 1 to use....like the devil, black hole, etc)

[pfti]

There's more than one kind of "restricted list". Magic and this thread subscribes to the you only get x copies of restricted cards in your deck" version. FFG games (game of thrones and destiny) use the "you can only pick one card from the restricted list to put in your deck" version.

Maybe 1e needs a latter variation? One of 1e's biggest issues was players spamming all the abusive stuff in a single deck. If you can only ever use one of them, it becomes much easier to play around.

So maybe we keep some things banned bc they are just never good (rogue Borg mercs) but many other things go on the list of pick only 1 to use....like the devil, black hole, etc)

We could call it the "cheese tray"

[Smiley]

I'm going for no but I do thing that we should not be allowed to have a free amount of copies of cards. 3-4 would suffice (with some exceptions). This maybe is sort of a Restricted list now that I think about it. =)

I do like the Ban list though. It gets problem cards out of the pool and makes the card pool smaller.