[Discovery suxs]

If you ask me (and nobody did), I would personally caution against giving DQ more power. I agree that there's a differential right now, but, given the precarious state of the power curve right now, the game's ideal solution would be to deflate the speed and power of the rest of the game, not inflate the speed and power of DQ to match the current / pace.

Being, imo, one of the most knowledgeable people around these parts, I would say your thoughts are always welcome.

Having said that, the bolded is my long time thinking as well. One of the things that attracted me to the game, some 483893 billion years ago, was the complexity and strategy. My roommate and I used to play games that last 2 hours (this was around Mirror Mirror). This appealed to me since most of the other CCGs were games that lasted a very short amount of time. STCCG stood in another area with very little company.

The game still requires forethought and strategy but I think those strategies are SOMEwhat mitigated by the current wave of "report salad" and endgame within 8 turns. Your strategy becomes a wee bit less important when, by turn 4, you are attemping a mission with 20 dudes in play.

I realize I am in the minority on this and most people prefer the current speed aspect of the game. That is great and I cant/wont speak for them. However, as noted above, my current line of thinking is to slow it down a bit. Maybe bake in a rule to OTF where free plays per turn are limited? I dont know. I dont have an obvious answer. Again, just my feelings on the matter.

I would like to make decks using other types of cards. Honestly the current game is so fast. If I mess up the spaceline. My opponent already has 20 dudes when I already lost the game because of playing those cards

[BCSWowbagger]

Ironic suggestion now that now we're complaining about Delta being under-powered relative to the last 3 years of Design. Clearly either there were some lessons not learned or your paradigm of what the game should be isn't in line with Design's/ the Brand Manager's.

I think there's a healthy dollop of Column C: Design only has a broad guess at the power level of a given card or set when it reaches release. Testing is not nearly exhaustive enough to give anyone certainty about that. (Nor can it be, with an understaffed and overworked playtesting department.)

Like, when we released The Cage, we were very confident that were better than and worse than pre-Benefactor-errata . Other than that, we had some pretty huge error bars. Our power target was "a little better than TNG Fed / par with / a little worse than ," and we'd gathered as much feedback as we could to try to hit that target, but ultimately the only way to know a set's power level is to release it into the wild and see how it fares.

I think it's clear that post-The Cage hit the dartboard above our target. Whether it's out-of-bounds for the current environment, or whether the current environment as a whole needs an overhaul, is above my paygrade. It's become a question for Errata and (to a great extent) the Director.

In a similar-but-not-quite-identical situation, a lot of 's power inflation happened (this is my personal take on it, not a universally accepted opinion) because Design and the primary group doing Playtesting turned out to have quite different definitions of "competitive power level", and nobody realized this until well into the testing cycle for The Cage. So, throughout Broken Bow, Live Long and Prosper, Cold Front, and Metamorphosis, Design would ask, "Is this competitive?" meaning, "Is this in the neighborhood of post-errata ?" And Playtesting would reply, "Yes, this is competitive," meaning, "This is in the neighborhood of pre-errata ." Once you get that, it's no shock that cards like Wisdom of Surak and Holographic Camo ended up as powerful as they were.

So Design wasn't sitting around saying, "Boy, let's speed this game up. Let's degenerate it Delta-style." We were trying rather hard to not do that. We tried to strike a balance, but had a pretty rough go of that balance the last few sets. It's not like we always err on the side of too much power, either: I think it's clear, years later, that we accidentally left well underpowered, and our fear of repeating that mistake may have fueled our own reluctance to cut risky stuff. And, of course, whenever we rolled out anything that smacked of being underpowered, plenty of people instantly raised the specter of , whose underpoweredness (especially at release, pre-Warp Pack) is (internally) considered CC Design's worst power level failure.

(My impression is that Project G'Kar is getting a bit more testing, from a bit more diverse pool of testers, than other recent sets, so hopefully it will break the pattern and get back on the curve.)

[AllenGould]

If memory serves, the problem with the and "treaties" were:

1. They weren't Treaties, so were immune to all the usual cards that put some failsafes on treaty decks.

2. They had bonus toys in addition to being unkillable omni-treaties (free reports, ability to attempt other missions, immunity to assimilation).

3. The / personnel effectively make these triple treaties if you need them to be (I seem to remember Equinox + Vidiian + Hirogen being popular?)

I can't think of any reason why the DQ folks couldn't get a proper Treaty: A/B, other than the general skittishness around DQ rampancy.

[Se7enofMine]

Allen makes a good point.

If the treaty aspect is something the general populace wants, a few simple treaty cards are pretty to drum up and toss in the next expansion.

I cant imagine "Treaty: Kazon - Vidiian" would require that much playtesting nor would it out a huge dent in any power curve.

[Discovery suxs]

Allen makes a good point.

If the treaty aspect is something the general populace wants, a few simple treaty cards are pretty to drum up and toss in the next expansion.

I cant imagine "Treaty: Kazon - Vidiian" would require that much playtesting nor would it out a huge dent in any power curve.

Just like the treaty for kazon now. I think it should be a treaty for something outside the delta quadrant.

Cardassian /kazon treaty now is pretty much only for dominion war efforts in my opinion anyway. Spacedoor the keldon cardassian ship to the NA outpost. Since it does not have to be matching afflication. There is over 13 cardassian asp you can special report to the keldon ship. I don't see any other use for it.


Kazon - Vidiian treaty would take the game right back to before the errata. Kazon vidiian, kazon hirogen, and kazon federation were the top 3 decks.

We you combined any of those together. You end up with borg like decks for different reasons.

Kazon vidiians for example. Now you got awesome ships that can harvest your people. The weakness of kazon are now filled with vidiians.

Kazon hirogen armada is called that for obvious reasons.

Kazon federation has so many tricks basically the opponent has lost the game before they even started unless you get the jump with a speed solver deck. Ds9 deck for example you might as well quit at the beginning of the game.

[sexecutioner]

Obviously

But I'm too busy focusing on getting sorted first

[Discovery suxs]

Obviously

But I'm too busy focusing on getting sorted first

You do that

[Borg King]

My vote is for as it seems there are a few ways to play the affiliation but not all of those avenues are quite top tier.

I have a lot of fun with my Ferengi decks but I do find them challenging to build and they are not what I would bring to a tournament if I hoped to even place.

A small "booster pack" that could give , , / and all property Ferengi decks some more options would go a long way to make them more meta competitive; especially considering how many Ferengi cards have been produced but don't see play.

[Discovery suxs]

My vote is for as it seems there are a few ways to play the affiliation but not all of those avenues are quite top tier.

I have a lot of fun with my Ferengi decks but I do find them challenging to build and they are not what I would bring to a tournament if I hoped to even place.

A small "booster pack" that could give , , / and all property Ferengi decks some more options would go a long way to make them more meta competitive; especially considering how many Ferengi cards have been produced but don't see play.

Tng ferengi are very strong. 2 freeplay engines. Tng quark beats v'ger alone. You can use the 35th rule on quark.

Enterprise Fenergi are very weak besides there 1 big 4 card combo. I tried to set it up once but it's alot of work to basically steal your opponents ship out from under them then get points for selling it. It should be alot of work of course. I'm just saying it is hard to pull off with very limited enterprise Fenergi.

[Dunnagh]

Kazon - Vidiian treaty would take the game right back to before the errata. Kazon vidiian, kazon hirogen, and kazon federation were the top 3 decks.

You forget that a LOT of other stuff changed, too:
DQSS, Caretaker, Barzan Wormhole are the strongest 3 - YAAM is another big contender for the Delta nerf. I think allowing the treaty once again would at least be worth playtesting.

[Discovery suxs]

Kazon - Vidiian treaty would take the game right back to before the errata. Kazon vidiian, kazon hirogen, and kazon federation were the top 3 decks.

You forget that a LOT of other stuff changed, too:
DQSS, Caretaker, Barzan Wormhole are the strongest 3 - YAAM is another big contender for the Delta nerf. I think allowing the treaty once again would at least be worth playtesting.

I'm fine with a treaty like the kazon current treaty. Kazon may mix with a afflication from a different quadrant.

If you compare the original kazon collective to the current one. Kazon lost so much more than the treaty. They lost there main freeplay engine. The original says if you have a maje in play. You may play a personnel of the sect for free. The current one says once each turn. So if you had 5 majes out you could end up with 5 Freeplays in one turn. They could also attend na missions which is really not relevant today.

The current treaty you could splash in dominion war efforts for 13 cardassian Freeplays.

I don't want the hirogen kazon armada back in the game. Battles should be revamped to complete with that deck. The deck breaks the limited battle system.

[Dunnagh]

If you compare the original kazon collective to the current one. Kazon lost so much more than the treaty. They lost there main freeplay engine. The original says if you have a maje in play. You may play a personnel of the sect for free. The current one says once each turn. So if you had 5 majes out you could end up with 5 Freeplays in one turn. They could also attend na missions which is really not relevant today.

It was always once each turn. That did not change.