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By phaserihardlyknowher (Ben Daeuber)
 - Beta Quadrant
 -  
#558102
I was wondering the same thing, but interpreted the answer as "no" from the entry on owner in the glossary:
The owner of a card is the player who originally stocked that card in their game deck (or brought it into play from outside the game). Even if you lose control of a card you own, you remain its owner and therefore still have it in play.
(Emphasis mine)

You do not own the card, therefor do not have it in play. Obviously, take that guess with large grain of salt.
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First Edition Rules Master
By BCSWowbagger (James Heaney)
 - First Edition Rules Master
 -  
Community Contributor
#558124
Enabran wrote: Sun Jul 18, 2021 3:37 am Cardassian Liberation Front

"Plays on a Cardassia Region [P]; discard if you have a facility in play. ..."
"Have in play" = "own"

We have recently tried revising the rules to make this clearer, but it's still a tricky concept.

EDIT: Not sure this was clear from my post otherwise, so, to be explicit: "have in play" = "own," so your Cardassian Liberation Front doesn't care about the Earth Outpost opponent downloaded with Test For Weakness, because you don't have that outpost in play; your opponent does. You control it, but you don't own it.
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By Enabran
 - Beta Quadrant
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2E Austrian National Second Runner-Up 2022
#558134
Well... now I am confused. If "you have in play" is the same as "you own" then I can play Ferengi Financial Data Net to draw cards even if you have assimilated/Breinwashed all of my [Fer] Greed personnel?

Plays to discard your hand. Draw a card for each unique [Fer] Greed personnel you have in play. Discard event.
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By Armus (Brian Sykes)
 - The Center of the Galaxy
 -  
Regent
Community Contributor
#558138
Enabran wrote: Mon Jul 19, 2021 9:04 am Well... now I am confused. If "you have in play" is the same as "you own" then I can play Ferengi Financial Data Net to draw cards even if you have assimilated/Breinwashed all of my [Fer] Greed personnel?

Plays to discard your hand. Draw a card for each unique [Fer] Greed personnel you have in play. Discard event.
You do still have those guys in play. E.g., if Brunt got assimilated, you can't play another copy because you already have one in play.

However, you can't target them with FFDN because they're no longer [Fer] Greed personnel... they're [Bor] Greed personnel. :wink:
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By BCSWowbagger (James Heaney)
 - First Edition Rules Master
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Community Contributor
#558149
Enabran wrote: Mon Jul 19, 2021 9:04 am Well... now I am confused. If "you have in play" is the same as "you own" then I can play Ferengi Financial Data Net to draw cards even if you have assimilated/Breinwashed all of my [Fer] Greed personnel?

Plays to discard your hand. Draw a card for each unique [Fer] Greed personnel you have in play. Discard event.
Yes (if they are still [Fer] , as Armus noted).

Furthermore, even if your opponent has them Brainwashed and they are still [Fer], your opponent cannot use Ferengi Financial Data Net on them, because your opponent will never have them in play.

I was surprised when I discovered this, to put it mildly, but it's the only way to not make a mess of the uniqueness rule. For example (putting it in spoiler tags 'cause it's wonky)...

If we reversed this Decipher rule and made it so that "you have in play" all cards you control, consider what might happen in a mirror match between two [1E-TNG] [Fed] decks. I successfully hit you with Alien Parasites and take control of your U.S.S. Enterprise. It is now mine until stopped. However, I already have a copy of U.S.S. Enterprise in play. Under the uniqueness rule, I can only have in play one copy of U.S.S. Enterprise at a time, and, under this proposed alternative rule, "have in play" = "control." Therefore, as soon as I take control of your Enterprise with Alien Parasites, I'm in violation of the uniqueness rule and must discard your Enterprise, along with all personnel aboard. Alien Parasites turns into a Total Ship Kill card in mirror matches, all because of a weird fluke of the uniqueness rule.


It is possible there are ways around this, but all of them that I've explored would involve changing some things in ways players would notice, and obviously Rules prefers not to do that, so we've kept the Decipher rule in place.
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By Enabran
 - Beta Quadrant
 -  
2E Austrian National Second Runner-Up 2022
#558329
phaserihardlyknowher wrote: Sun Jul 18, 2021 10:29 am
The owner of a card is the player who originally stocked that card in their game deck (or brought it into play from outside the game). Even if you lose control of a card you own, you remain its owner and therefore still have it in play.
Fifth
[SD] Once each turn, may return to hand one of your [BO] Incident, Event, or
Objective cards in play.

After your quote I can use her skill to return cards from the Discardpile?

I was in the opinion that "in play" is, when I brought the card from my hand on the table. Therefore a card is not "in play" when it is in my Deck, Hand or discard pile.
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By Professor Scott (Mathew McCalpin)
 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
Trailblazer
1E Cardassia Regional Champion 2023
#558330
You are correct, cards in discard pile are not in play. The quote was about loss of control, meaning the card remains in play but you no longer control it, but you still own it.. You don't control card in your discard pile, and since they are not in play, you can not use Fifth to recover them.

From the Glossary In Play

Text is long so I did not post the entire entry here.

A card in play may leave play by being discarded (to the discard pile, bonus point area, The Next Emanation, etc.), placed out-of- play, re-seeded (e.g., with Q-Type Android), relocated as a marker (e.g., a completed objective such as Assimilate Homeworld), or returned to a player's hand, draw deck, or side deck; it is then no longer "in play."
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By BCSWowbagger (James Heaney)
 - First Edition Rules Master
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Community Contributor
#558347
Professor Scott wrote: Fri Jul 23, 2021 11:16 am You are correct, cards in discard pile are not in play. The quote was about loss of control, meaning the card remains in play but you no longer control it, but you still own it.. You don't control card in your discard pile, and since they are not in play, you can not use Fifth to recover them.

From the Glossary In Play

Text is long so I did not post the entire entry here.

A card in play may leave play by being discarded (to the discard pile, bonus point area, The Next Emanation, etc.), placed out-of- play, re-seeded (e.g., with Q-Type Android), relocated as a marker (e.g., a completed objective such as Assimilate Homeworld), or returned to a player's hand, draw deck, or side deck; it is then no longer "in play."
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