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Shipping Manager
By SirDan (Dan Hamman)
 - Shipping Manager
 -  
ibbles  Trek Masters Tribbles Champion 2023
#589778
Hey Borg players!

When First Contact came out, Adapt: Negate Obstruction was a needed card because there were a handful of dilemmas they Borg just couldn't get past.

These days, there are Borg personnel that can solve a lot of these old cards. And modern Borg decks can be flexible enough to go somewhere else if needed.

I've started looking at playing to counter interrupts, specifically spamming Goddess of Empathy. If Negate Obstruction was not available, how would you adapt as a Borg player?
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Director of Organized Play
By LORE (Kris Sonsteby)
 - Director of Organized Play
 -  
Architect
1E Andoria Regional Champion 2023
2E Andoria Regional Champion 2023
W.C.T. Chairman's Trophy winner 2014-2015
#589780
Queen skill change and skill-sharing with the Vinculum I imagine. While I am never good at getting to the end game when playing my Borg Aggro deck, in theory I will have assimilated enough of their personnel to make anything skill related not matter via skill-sharing. *shrug* that is what I got off the top of my head.
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By Smiley (Cristoffer Wiker)
 - Gamma Quadrant
 -  
Continuing Committee Member - Retired
#589781
I'm mostly trying to figure out how to get past the walls that do not require skills. Some you can send the Queen on but usually only once =)
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First Edition Rules Master
By BCSWowbagger (James Heaney)
 - First Edition Rules Master
 -  
Community Contributor
#589784
I would probably just stop even pretending to scout missions.

Yes, TNG Borg are lightning-fast scouters, but I don't enjoy playing TNG Borg, so I very rarely scout missions.

Borg Classic (aka Full Borg) can afford to lean on non-mission [Obj] (usually Assimilate Counterpart) to score mission points, then build up a further lead with Add Distinctiveness. Doing missions as Borg Classic is, frankly, a ginormous headache. They're good at it, but there's so many moving parts, and the ubiquity of Experience BiJ! has added a bunch more moving parts that make it (for me) a bit of a slog. Adapt solves some of those headaches and makes it (sometimes) worth my time. If Adapt went away... well, as @LORE says about his aggro Borg deck, "Pfft, this deck doesn't do missions."*

I think it would be a mistake to conflate current power level problems in TNG Borg with current problems in Full Borg. The factions are radically different and have nearly opposite problems right now (IMO). It would be very easy to nerf TNG Borg in a way that actually pushes Full Borg closer to degeneracy (or vice versa).

*Note that his deck often does do a mission -- more often than mine does, anyway -- but only when gunning for a full win, which is usually unnecessary and sometimes impractical.
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First Edition Rules Master
By BCSWowbagger (James Heaney)
 - First Edition Rules Master
 -  
Community Contributor
#589797
boromirofborg wrote:does anyone have a list of walls that need adapt to pass these days?
I only got through a little more than half of the walls in the database before I had to go back to my job, but here's what I found:

practically speaking, Persistent Individuality
often, Armus: Energy Field
normally, Chula: The Dice
normally, Chula: The Door
practically speaking, Clan People
often, Hippocratic Oath
In The Pale Moonlight
Inter Arma Enim Silent Leges
Koon-ut-kal-if-fee

Then there's some that Borg can technically pass with Queens/Counterparts, but it's difficult and involves a lot of skill-switching / blind luck because their skill gaps are enormous:

Authorized Access Only
Faux Pas
All Treachery dilemmas
Drumhead
Maglock
Misinterpreted History (the initial kill makes this quite hard)
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By Orbin (James Monsebroten)
 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
#589800
Most dilemmas have a way for the Borg to get by them without Adapt (though some are really hard to do). That being said, my problem list if I was locked out / prevented from using Adapt are:

TNG Borg cannot pass Temptations of the Flesh without an adapt.
All Borg cannot pass Precision Piloting without adapt.

From James' list above
TNG Borg cannot pass In The Pale Moonlight without adapt.

-James M
 
 - Beta Quadrant
 -  
#589813
BCSWowbagger wrote: Thu Dec 08, 2022 2:49 pm Then there's some that Borg can technically pass with Queens/Counterparts, but it's difficult and involves a lot of skill-switching / blind luck because their skill gaps are enormous:
...
All Treachery dilemmas
...
Of these, Q Gets the Point notably requires a Borg player to find some Treachery, since it is Q-related and can't be Adapted to.

(I guess this is not exactly what the thread is about, but if you're planning to scout missions with Borg, in theory you should already have a plan to get Treachery somehow without relying on Adapts. In practice, QGTP is weak enough against everyone else that you never see it and your contingency can be to just target another mission.)
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First Edition Rules Master
By BCSWowbagger (James Heaney)
 - First Edition Rules Master
 -  
Community Contributor
#589817
Orbin wrote: Thu Dec 08, 2022 3:20 pm TNG Borg cannot pass In The Pale Moonlight without adapt.
How do Classic Borg pass ITPM without Adapt? I know ways to boost INTEGRITY but nothing pops into my head as a way to drain it -- not from your own personnel.
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By Commander Joe (Joe Kallstrom)
 - Beta Quadrant
 -  
#589818
BCSWowbagger wrote: Thu Dec 08, 2022 7:00 pm
Orbin wrote: Thu Dec 08, 2022 3:20 pm TNG Borg cannot pass In The Pale Moonlight without adapt.
How do Classic Borg pass ITPM without Adapt? I know ways to boost INTEGRITY but nothing pops into my head as a way to drain it -- not from your own personnel.
Q of Borg gets past it. He also has Treachery when needed.
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By Armus (Brian Sykes)
 - The Center of the Galaxy
 -  
Regent
Community Contributor
#589819
BCSWowbagger wrote: Thu Dec 08, 2022 7:00 pm
Orbin wrote: Thu Dec 08, 2022 3:20 pm TNG Borg cannot pass In The Pale Moonlight without adapt.
How do Classic Borg pass ITPM without Adapt? I know ways to boost INTEGRITY but nothing pops into my head as a way to drain it -- not from your own personnel.
Cortical Node Implant on a [SCD] or [SCN] Drone (or some Counterparts)
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By Orbin (James Monsebroten)
 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
#589823
Commander Joe wrote: Thu Dec 08, 2022 7:06 pm
BCSWowbagger wrote: Thu Dec 08, 2022 7:00 pm
Orbin wrote: Thu Dec 08, 2022 3:20 pm TNG Borg cannot pass In The Pale Moonlight without adapt.
How do Classic Borg pass ITPM without Adapt? I know ways to boost INTEGRITY but nothing pops into my head as a way to drain it -- not from your own personnel.
Q of Borg gets past it. He also has Treachery when needed.
Well, now I feel dumb :) I filtered to Counterparts and Queens and didn't think about Q :)
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By Orbin (James Monsebroten)
 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
#589824
Armus wrote: Thu Dec 08, 2022 7:30 pm
BCSWowbagger wrote: Thu Dec 08, 2022 7:00 pm
Orbin wrote: Thu Dec 08, 2022 3:20 pm TNG Borg cannot pass In The Pale Moonlight without adapt.
How do Classic Borg pass ITPM without Adapt? I know ways to boost INTEGRITY but nothing pops into my head as a way to drain it -- not from your own personnel.
Cortical Node Implant on a [SCD] or [SCN] Drone (or some Counterparts)
Brunt of Borg was what I was thinking of, and I have just found out that Q of Borg works as well, but the fact that I also missed Cortical Node Implant means that this dilemma should not have been on my concern list at all :)

-James M
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By Commander Joe (Joe Kallstrom)
 - Beta Quadrant
 -  
#589825
Orbin wrote: Thu Dec 08, 2022 8:41 pm
Armus wrote: Thu Dec 08, 2022 7:30 pm
BCSWowbagger wrote: Thu Dec 08, 2022 7:00 pm

How do Classic Borg pass ITPM without Adapt? I know ways to boost INTEGRITY but nothing pops into my head as a way to drain it -- not from your own personnel.
Cortical Node Implant on a [SCD] or [SCN] Drone (or some Counterparts)
Brunt of Borg was what I was thinking of, and I have just found out that Q of Borg works as well, but the fact that I also missed Cortical Node Implant means that this dilemma should not have been on my concern list at all :)

-James M
Just keep in mind that TNG Borg can't use implants if you're running Relentless .
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