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By SAM2000
 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
#525649
Armus wrote:
SAM2000 wrote:What happens if you have both Intercept Renegade and Expose Secret Buildup in play? They are both Orios System (although not regions).
You can't have both. They're personae.

Just like Study Rare Phenomenon and Attack at Rare Phenomenon
Oh dear. I have both in my current tournament deck :O
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By Armus (Brian Sykes)
 - The Center of the Galaxy
 -  
Regent
Community Contributor
#525655
SAM2000 wrote:
Armus wrote:
SAM2000 wrote:What happens if you have both Intercept Renegade and Expose Secret Buildup in play? They are both Orios System (although not regions).
You can't have both. They're personae.

Just like Study Rare Phenomenon and Attack at Rare Phenomenon
Oh dear. I have both in my current tournament deck :O
I suggest you PM the TD (I'm assuming this is (not a) Worlds, in which case it's pfti) and request guidance.

I'd say swap out one mission for a different one and move on, but I don't make the call in this case.
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Online OP Coordinator
By pfti (Jon Carter)
 - Online OP Coordinator
 -  
2E Cardassia Regional Champion 2023
#525656
just swap out one for round 4 and we will call it. This is what I get for not collecting deck lists
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Online OP Coordinator
By pfti (Jon Carter)
 - Online OP Coordinator
 -  
2E Cardassia Regional Champion 2023
#525664
You may not seed, nor include in your seed deck, more than once instance of the same mission persona, unless that mission is universal.
and the rest of the persona rules only apply to facilities, ships and people
The persona rule does not apply to other card types such as events or interrupts. See card titles.
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By SAM2000
 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
#525694
pfti wrote:
You may not seed, nor include in your seed deck, more than once instance of the same mission persona, unless that mission is universal.
and the rest of the persona rules only apply to facilities, ships and people
The persona rule does not apply to other card types such as events or interrupts. See card titles.
In my defence, when I last played Mission Personna didn't exist :)
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Director of First Edition
By MidnightLich (Charlie Plaine)
 - Director of First Edition
 -  
Prophet
#525696
I wonder if our crack programming team can make it so the deck builder catches/prevents this?

-crp
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By Armus (Brian Sykes)
 - The Center of the Galaxy
 -  
Regent
Community Contributor
#525700
SAM2000 wrote:
pfti wrote:
You may not seed, nor include in your seed deck, more than once instance of the same mission persona, unless that mission is universal.
and the rest of the persona rules only apply to facilities, ships and people
The persona rule does not apply to other card types such as events or interrupts. See card titles.
In my defence, when I last played Mission Personna didn't exist :)
TBH, if we had played i would have had a 50% chance of catching it. At best.
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Online OP Coordinator
By pfti (Jon Carter)
 - Online OP Coordinator
 -  
2E Cardassia Regional Champion 2023
#525702
Same, and it isnt the TD's job to enforce the rules and not really a huge harm
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First Edition Rules Master
 - First Edition Rules Master
 -  
Continuing Committee Member - Retired
Community Contributor
#525704
pfti wrote:Same, and it isnt the TD's job to enforce the rules and not really a huge harm
It *isn't* the TD's job to enforce the rules? :shifty:
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Online OP Coordinator
By pfti (Jon Carter)
 - Online OP Coordinator
 -  
2E Cardassia Regional Champion 2023
#525709
AllenGould wrote:
pfti wrote:Same, and it isnt the TD's job to enforce the rules and not really a huge harm
It *isn't* the TD's job to enforce the rules? :shifty:
Only when asked is what I understand. Otherwise the players are up
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First Edition Rules Master
 - First Edition Rules Master
 -  
Continuing Committee Member - Retired
Community Contributor
#525711
pfti wrote:
AllenGould wrote:
pfti wrote:Same, and it isnt the TD's job to enforce the rules and not really a huge harm
It *isn't* the TD's job to enforce the rules? :shifty:
Only when asked is what I understand. Otherwise the players are up
That used to be my understanding, but I thought the current rule was more... activist.
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By 9of24 (Jeremy Huth)
 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
#525714
This is the TD expectations entry from the OPG:
A Tournament Director’s primary responsibility is the integrity of each tournament they runs. They are required to be proficient in the rules of the game they are hosting (First Edition, Second Edition, or Tribbles) and must adhere to The Continuing Committee guidelines set forth in the Organized Play Guide. The various rules documents are a Tournament Directors primary resource when making rulings in their events. Absent a clear precedent, Tournament Director’s must use sound judgment when making a new ruling and said ruling is binding for the remainder of the event unless evidence sufficient to overturn the ruling is presented.

Tournament Directors will not interfere in any games in progress, whether intentionally or unintentionally. Intervention in a game in process is only warranted if a player asks for a resolution, or if a player exhibits behaviour that would otherwise warrant a penalty.
It seems the TD is primarily responsible for ensuring the event runs smoothly. The closest thing to enforcing the rules seems to be the bit at the end. If a player is exhibiting behavior that would warrant a penalty, the applicable offense in this case would be that of Contempt:Deception (see below). However, in order to to issue that penalty determining a player's intent is emphasized. To my read, that would mean if a TD sees a play error, they are only to interfere if a player requests their assistance or if they believe the player making the error is doing so intentionally to deceive their opponent.
C1. Deception [Level 4]: Deception is defined as any intentional subversion of any game rules, tournament guidelines, or procedural methods designed to give a player an advantage in a game. There must be sufficient evidence of the player’s intent when issuing this penalty. Examples: Using a false identity when registering for a tournament, misrepresentation of game results, false shuffles, any covert card manipulation (i.e. sleight of hand) that changes a card’s position or orientation (or reveals its identity if hidden), or otherwise illegally gaining advance knowledge of game conditions.
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