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By Orbin (James Monsebroten)
 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
#554102
I'm taking a look at playing the Coming of Age starters against each other. Each starter has a bonus point card and the one for the Ferengi is Business Gambit.

None of the decks has equipment in them... does this mean that in a Coming of Age starter vs Coming of Age starter match the Ferengi can't use Business Gambit? ie: do I have to do the second line to get points?

-James M
 
By HoodieDM
 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
#554118
Yes, it should still work for two reasons.

#1 to just play the card, you must meet the requirement, but no equipment is involved.

#2 you can choose to steal an equipment and b/c it's not there, that portion "fizzles" but the whole card doesn't. So it still plays and you get the points. You can do the second option to download, but then your opponent can check your entire decks to verify and it still fizzles, but now they've checked the deck, so that's just not a good idea :)
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By Professor Scott (Mathew McCalpin)
 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
Trailblazer
1E Cardassia Regional Champion 2023
#554145
patrick wrote: Wed May 19, 2021 9:42 am Why does this work without equipment? It doesn't say "You may steal" or "You may download" ...

This sounds the same as the second use of Comfort Women where you have to download a site to use it.
Because it says: "OR Seeds on Bajor. Your [Baj] females become [Car] dissidents with "Terok Nor" in lore (even if not in play); download a site."

as opposed to: OR Seeds on Bajor. Your [Baj] females become [Car] dissidents with "Terok Nor" in lore (even if not in play). Download a site."

With a . instead of a ; they are independent steps, and as thus shouldn't rely on each other to function. (I am sure rules will take issue with this.)

For clarity the ; makes the download part of the preceding sentence, and in 1e is you can't do all, you can't do any.

Technically you should still be able to seed it at Bajor, but if you can't download a site, it just sits there and does nothing. For whatever reason, rules says if you can't download, you can't even seed it which I disagree with.
 
By HoodieDM
 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
#554149
Yeah, Comfort Women is a whole nother issue. I agree with you Keii, the download the site isn't part of the "Seed" requirement. :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

It doesn't make sense when one card works but another doesn't for basically the same thing, but b/c of a period here or there or a semi-colon, it makes it very confusing, for new players and even veterans.
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By Professor Scott (Mathew McCalpin)
 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
Trailblazer
1E Cardassia Regional Champion 2023
#554155
HoodieDM wrote: Wed May 19, 2021 3:50 pm Yeah, Comfort Women is a whole nother issue. I agree with you Keii, the download the site isn't part of the "Seed" requirement. :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

It doesn't make sense when one card works but another doesn't for basically the same thing, but b/c of a period here or there or a semi-colon, it makes it very confusing, for new players and even veterans.
And even more so to our non-native speaking brethren and sisteren?.
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First Edition Rules Master
By BCSWowbagger (James Heaney)
 - First Edition Rules Master
 -  
Community Contributor
#554177
KazonPADD wrote: Tue May 18, 2021 8:42 pm I recall asking this at the time we developed the set, and was told it still works
Who told you this? I don't doubt that it happened, and I wouldn't even be surprised to learn that I agreed with it and then later forgot about it, but -- particularly since this is An Issue Under Consideration at the moment -- it would be nice to track down the pertinent records.
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First Edition Rules Master
By BCSWowbagger (James Heaney)
 - First Edition Rules Master
 -  
Community Contributor
#554211
Short answer: No.

Long answer: these are some of the cards under scrutiny. Note, for instance, that Establish Gateway takes pains to note "if possible."

But that's just the downloaders, and probably not all of them. The "do as much as you can" rule proposal encompasses a considerably bigger swath of cards -- any card that says, "If X, then Y and Z," -- and it's hard to be sure one has located all of them, without simply sitting down and reading every single card in the game (which I have done before, multiple times, for rules research, but it is exhausting work, almost impossible to pay proper attention to for an extended period).
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First Edition Rules Master
By BCSWowbagger (James Heaney)
 - First Edition Rules Master
 -  
Community Contributor
#554223
:D Thanks!

Of course, I will take your compliment as an excuse to pass it on to others: the real MVPs are the Rules Committee members who labor in anonymity. They work very hard (harder than me, this month anyway) and get exactly no public recognition for it -- but they're an amazing group.

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