[Faithful Reader]

Am I going to be totally lost watching this thing?

Strictly speaking, no. All you need to know is that the purple guy is trying to get the six shinny McGuffins. Even if you don't know who Spider Man is, they give a good early summary of everyone's abilities. Not just that, but they do a great job of letting you know how each groups gets to where.

For that matter, these movies have been a pretty good scam. They give you everything you need to know at the start of the movie so you don't need to be all caught up and see every single one, but they make you feel otherwise.

Kind of like not reading to read the Harry Potter books in order to know what's going on, how you can start off with Deep Space Nine without watching The Next Generation, The Old Testament doesn't end with To be Continued , etc.

Every scene feels like a super carefully calculated formula around how many lines, jokes, hits, etc. each character gets when.

Definitely seemed more geared towards people watching it than being an effective team. Then again, they really didn't have all that much say over where they went. At some point, we'll put together a fan version of whose powers would be best with whom.

[Faithful Reader]

At the risk of being 'that guy,' the Hulk is all over the promotional campaign. Obviously they didn't want to spoil his arc (which was friggin awesome) but why not just leave him out of the shot. I can't imagine someone was sitting around thinking "Hulk is at Wakanda? I'm gonna see this eighteen times!" or anything.

And did Thor say Rabbit one too many times?

[AllenGould]

Saw it on Sunday, and have been letting it percolating in the brain.

I enjoyed the movie, I accidentally called the ending by making a joke (because I didn't think they'd *actually* end it there)... but it does suffer from a similar problem to Age of Ultron, where they have to dedicate a bit too much time to moving the deck chairs around to set up the next block of movies, and while IW did it better than AU's "hey, Thor needs to go wander away for a moment now because the studio wants to set up Ragnarok which has nothing to do with this film", it does make me wonder if it would have been better served as two films.

[Fritzinger]

Magnificent! I salute their bravery with that ending. I really expected a magic trick at the end.

[Faithful Reader]

.... it does make me wonder if it would have been better served as two films.

You mean to make it a trilogy? They're already benching ninety nine percent of their cast and we're left with Ant Man and the cheating they're doing with Captain Marvel. They would need to either keep someone else out of the action or further delay their films, either of which is happening.

[AllenGould]

.... it does make me wonder if it would have been better served as two films.

You mean to make it a trilogy? They're already benching ninety nine percent of their cast and we're left with Ant Man and the cheating they're doing with Captain Marvel. They would need to either keep someone else out of the action or further delay their films, either of which is happening.

My wife's suggestion was to split it between the two groups (one movie following Team Cosmic, the other following the Team Earth), and then that gives you room to put some actual plot there in addition to the Required Action Scenes and Required Phase Four Setup Scenes.

I did hear a good reason for the lack of Ant-Man, though: since his movies are capers and more light-hearted, and AntMan&Wasp is sandwiched between the two IW flicks, it's a bit rude to end IW, and then go "stay tuned for the wacky hijinks of AntMan and Wasp, and then we'll get back to The End of The Universe!". (My money is that timeline-wise it'll be just before the big ending, to setup why he's back in action.)

I like how they're doing Marvel - gives her a proper introduction before dumping her into the giant universe.

[Faithful Reader]

My wife's suggestion was to split it between the two groups (one movie following Team Cosmic, the other following the Team Earth), and then that gives you room to put some actual plot there in addition to the Required Action Scenes and Required Phase Four Setup Scenes.

With all due respect to your lovely wife, one of the reasons why Infinity War worked is because it all happened in one movie. Thanos went from not having any (okay, one) to getting all five. We also have a very good multi textured characterization of him that wouldn't have worked spread over two movies.

Plus, it would be a structural nightmare. Earth is at the start (okay, after the 'prologue') and end and Team Cosmic would themselves bounce between said prologue, and Thor/Rocket/Groot and Stark/Parker/Lord. One of the great strengths is not only do we get a moment for each character, but you're never lost wondering who is where.

I did hear a good reason for the lack of Ant-Man, though: since his movies are capers and more light-hearted, and AntMan&Wasp is sandwiched between the two IW flicks, it's a bit rude to end IW, and then go "stay tuned for the wacky hijinks of AntMan and Wasp, and then we'll get back to The End of The Universe!". (My money is that timeline-wise it'll be just before the big ending, to setup why he's back in action.)

I dunno, they did a good job of integrating Star Lord's quirkiness into Iron Man's banter. Not to mention that I can't see Post Dark World Thor getting along with Groot and Rocket as well as post Ragnarok Thor. I imagine if Thanos stopped the pre-Civil-War battle, Ant Man wouldn't be all hero worshipy with Stark.

I like how they're doing Marvel - gives her a proper introduction before dumping her into the giant universe.

It worked for Black Widow. But yeah, Marvel's going to have a bigger need for a backstory.

[Tim]

I did hear a good reason for the lack of Ant-Man, though: since his movies are capers and more light-hearted, and AntMan&Wasp is sandwiched between the two IW flicks, it's a bit rude to end IW, and then go "stay tuned for the wacky hijinks of AntMan and Wasp, and then we'll get back to The End of The Universe!". (My money is that timeline-wise it'll be just before the big ending, to setup why he's back in action.)

I dunno, they did a good job of integrating Star Lord's quirkiness into Iron Man's banter. Not to mention that I can't see Post Dark World Thor getting along with Groot and Rocket as well as post Ragnarok Thor. I imagine if Thanos stopped the pre-Civil-War battle, Ant Man wouldn't be all hero worshipy with Stark.

I don't think they did a good job of integrating Star Lord's quirkiness. The actor was definitely capable of the all important comedic beats, but the use of the character to me felt like a ridiculously stupid, whiny caricature of himself. I totally get the condensing of the character to fit in and stuff, I just feel it could have been done better.

I agree with Allen about the lack of Ant-Man. Spider-Man and Star Lord already contributed his thing, and tonally any sort of tie-into the Ant-Man movie wouldn't work well.


My main thought about the movie (spoilers in hidden tags):

I felt Thanos's new ethos was lame. The population plague villain is a huge cliche that I've seen/read enough times. I've never thought it was the compelling utilitarian environmental quandary that writers seem to think it is. At a galactic scale it didn't make any sense.

In the comics Thanos motivation was about exploring the idea of a nihilist God commanding death. Thanos had a relationship with death herself, who is his sort of his imaginary girlfriend. His control of death is part of his obsession of Death.

In addition to the character of Death, the Starlin comics also had trippy sequences with the Cosmic God characters --- Eternity, Living Tribunal, other celestials. They deal with whether or not to make value judgements on a new nihilist god.

I do think the Thanos and Gamora relationship worked, simply because of how well the actors/CG pulled it off.

[AllenGould]

Reply to Timo (spoilers)

I'm not sure the original comics plot would have worked, for a couple reasons. For one, I don't think the "Death as actual person Thanos is trying to get his smoochy-times with" would play in 2018. And the original comic plotline does not lend itself well to the movies IMO. The second is that you'd either be airlifting Death into the plot now (which means you get to spend twenty minutes on the CGI love story), or else they'd be teasing a second character through all these movies, and people were already cranky with Thanos not doing anything as is. Shoehorning in a Maxwell House (or I guess Long Long Man is the new version) mini-story into all these movies so IW can still hit the ground running? Meeeh?

But really, I just wanted to make sure everyone saw this, because this really should have been a marketing crossover:

[Tim]

Reply to Timo (spoilers)

I'm not sure the original comics plot would have worked, for a couple reasons. For one, I don't think the "Death as actual person Thanos is trying to get his smoochy-times with" would play in 2018. And the original comic plotline does not lend itself well to the movies IMO. The second is that you'd either be airlifting Death into the plot now (which means you get to spend twenty minutes on the CGI love story), or else they'd be teasing a second character through all these movies, and people were already cranky with Thanos not doing anything as is. Shoehorning in a Maxwell House (or I guess Long Long Man is the new version) mini-story into all these movies so IW can still hit the ground running? Meeeh?

I agree...

I'm not a purest at all, things had to be adapted to film. I just think that particular choice was lame, and missed the epicness I was hoping to experience.

[HoodieDM]

I loved what they did with Thanos. It was more or less Thanos: The Movie. Our heroes didn't need their journies b/c they've all had their origin movies, but they basically made us understand Thanos. It was HIS back story. For once, the Villain got the whole movie which I love!!!

Saw a 2nd time and enjoyed it just as much as the first, one of my top fav movies of all time now!!

~D

[bosskamiura]

I loved what they did with Thanos. It was more or less Thanos: The Movie. Our heroes didn't need their journies b/c they've all had their origin movies, but they basically made us understand Thanos. It was HIS back story. For once, the Villain got the whole movie which I love!!!

Saw a 2nd time and enjoyed it just as much as the first, one of my top fav movies of all time now!!

~D

You got that right! Thanos was awesome in this movie. I liked his parts the most.

TK