For other non-gameplay topics, especially those related to Star Trek and the Star Trek CCG, non-gameplay surveys, trivia questions and puzzles, constructive commentary and more.
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By SudenKapala (Suden Käpälä)
 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
1E The Neutral Zone Regional Participant 2021
#551769
monty42 wrote:if a number on a board somewhere really has that much of an influence on your enjoyment of the game,...
But we're nerds. It's in our nature even more, perhaps, than in the general populace's.
We play with cards that have numbers on them. (Give me Roga Danar over [Univ] Narik every day that I don't walk into a Spoonhead Trap.)
Myself, I get thrilled when I can squeeze 10 or 12 achvs out of one deck (because I'm new that still works). Sports have their numbers that need to be okay for people to enjoy them. It's human, I think, to be competitive to some extent, and/or look at numbers. (Those 2 overlap but not completely!)

But... it shouldn't be a holy grail, indeed. There's also other fun to be had in this particular hobby. :thumbsup:
[ppl] need to stop telling other ppl how to feel about their accomplishments.
If it is being done, then yes, I agree. Above penchant for numbers (whether rating or achvs or "just playing" = sheer number of games) is personal taste!
monty42 wrote:If the pursuit of the ultimate goal diminishes your enjoyment of the actual experience, is it really worth it?
Myself, I struggle with this. By wanting to get experience with all these different formats and pools, and earn medals, I push my hobby to -- and over -- the limits of the time I want to spend with it. So, it becomes a chore at times.
If you don't experience that field of tension between your happy time with the game and your own desires that drive you to be a tad less happy in the game, you're a very lucky man.

Or perhaps I'm the only poor sod who ruins (some part of) his own fun by being a flawed human being... :shifty:

I hope so. :cross:

But... we're digressing.
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By monty42 (Benjamin Liebich)
 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
2E World Top 16 2019
Nemesis
2E German National Champion 2020
#551772
Just for the record, I don't even dispute Kevin's question whether or not online events should be rated.
I'd even go as far as saying scrap the ratings completely.
I mean if the guy who's in 1st place hasn't played for more than 7 years and the guy who's in 5th has won three times as many events as the guy in 2nd, they're clearly not representative. (Again I can only speak for 2E)
Players who play a lot know who the best players are. Maybe that's enough.
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By Keiimaster (Mathew McCalpin)
 - Beta Quadrant
 -  
#551773
eberlems wrote: Thu Apr 22, 2021 7:47 pm Isn't there an option for unsanctioned events?
AFAIK, most, if not all, achievements must be earned in a tournament, and pretty much all tournaments are sanctioned by default.

For me, earning the achievements without the ratings risk is a hollow victory. MVB has earned all those achievement points by putting his rating at risk. If I caught up to him in achievement points without risking my own rating, I would feel robbed, or at the very least I would feel that he was robbed.

I think the solution is to have some new achievements that can be acquired in a non sanctioned tournament format. Some of the existing achievements could also be acquired this way, like playing in multiple regions, or facing a number of different opponents, etc.

Release Event achievements , by contrast, should only be ratings risky tournaments, for example. (IMHO)
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By SudenKapala (Suden Käpälä)
 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
1E The Neutral Zone Regional Participant 2021
#551775
Keiimaster wrote: Thu Apr 22, 2021 8:12 pm AFAIK, most, if not all, achievements must be earned in a tournament, and pretty much all tournaments are sanctioned by default.
Not all tourney types are sanctioned.
Many (but not all) achvs currently must be earned in a sanctioned (and thus, rated) tourney.
Card pool also sometimes plays a role.
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By Armus (Brian Sykes)
 - The Center of the Galaxy
 -  
Goateed
Community Contributor
1E American National Second Runner-Up 2020
#551789
eberlems wrote: Thu Apr 22, 2021 7:47 pm Isn't there an option for unsanctioned events?
There's always an option for unsanctioned events.

Unfortunately they don't qualify for achievements.
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 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
2E World Semi-Finalist 2019
Grand Nagus
#551810
Just for the record, I don't even dispute Kevin's question whether or not online events should be rated.
I'd even go as far as saying scrap the ratings completely.
I mean if the guy who's in 1st place hasn't played for more than 7 years and the guy who's in 5th has won three times as many events as the guy in 2nd, they're clearly not representative. (Again I can only speak for 2E)
Players who play a lot know who the best players are. Maybe that's enough.
Table tennis uses ELO as well. And when you haven't played one event or league match in a year, you lose 100 points...
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 - The Center of the Galaxy
 -  
Continuing Committee Member - Retired
Community Contributor
#551838
Hoss-Drone wrote: Thu Apr 22, 2021 4:17 pm "It's just points on whiteboard" is a narrow-minded view. Those points were a goal that took countless hundreds of hours to achieve and came with sacrifice.
But is it meant to be permanent? Getting a boxing championship also requires hundreds of hours and sacrifice, but they don't let you just sit on it forever. :)

Also, what happens to the next generation of up-and-comers, if all the rating points are tied up in players who refuse to risk them? Ratings deflation is a thing, after all.
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By Armus (Brian Sykes)
 - The Center of the Galaxy
 -  
Goateed
Community Contributor
1E American National Second Runner-Up 2020
#551854
I care about hitting a 2000 rating once (though you might not know it from my recent deck choices).

Then I get the achievement that does stick around.

After that.... meh, whatever. I know I'm good. I don't need a number to prove it.
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By Mr.Sloan
 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
1E Austrian National Second Runner-Up 2020
#551855
some are after achievements, some after ELO, some after winning the tournament, some after neither.

personaly i like to build the best deck i can imagine. In constructed thats what i like to do and do in low level or high level tournaments, unsancted or sanctioned.

Outside the tournament i always point at and and advocate for errating NPE cards, like containment field swap or devil. But until errated i play cards if they are powerfull.
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Director of Organized Play
By LORE (Kris Sonsteby)
 - Director of Organized Play
 -  
Alpha Hunter
1E North American Continental Champion 2019
2E Andoria Regional Champion 2020
W.C.T. Chairman's Trophy winner 2014-2015
#551864
Armus wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 12:02 pm I care about hitting a 2000 rating once (though you might not know it from my recent deck choices).

Then I get the achievement that does stick around.

After that.... meh, whatever. I know I'm good. I don't need a number to prove it.
I have no dog in this fight, but will say hitting 1800 in 2E sealed rating was a goal I had because nobody has ever done it. Now that I have done it, I fully expect to give back several ratings points as I keep playing and I am totally ok with that. Even if my sealed rating drops 200 points, nobody can take away that I was the first to hit 1800. So... I definitely hear you, @Armus.
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By nobthehobbit (Daniel Pareja)
 - The Center of the Galaxy
 -  
Moderator
#551922
You always keep your lifetime high rating.

Also this is why, back when there were more tournaments and such and I actually remembered to do it, I tracked YTD ratings.
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Ambassador
By edgeofhearing (Lucas Thompson)
 - Ambassador
 -  
Socialite
Community Contributor
2E North American Continental Quarter-Finalist 2019
#551924
The only thing that matters to me is encouraging people to play. The current system we have is enough for some people, and that’s great. I just think we can do more.

Keep ELO, that’s fine, some people love it. Keep achievements, they’re another encouragement. But we need something else. Unlink achievements and ELO? That might help. Add another, more inflationary ratings system? That could be good. The only purpose that matters to me is encouraging people to play.
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Executive Officer
By jadziadax8 (Maggie Geppert)
 - Executive Officer
 -  
Grand Nagus
2E American National Second Runner-Up 2020
2E The Neutral Zone Regional Champion 2020
#551939
I think that online events should be rated. We have a large number of people here who, for various reasons, cannot play in person. Why should they be locked out of the ratings system?
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By Mr.Sloan
 - Delta Quadrant
 -  
1E Austrian National Second Runner-Up 2020
#551945
jadziadax8 wrote: Sat Apr 24, 2021 9:32 am I think that online events should be rated. We have a large number of people here who, for various reasons, cannot play in person. Why should they be locked out of the ratings system?
Yeah possiblites for that are good. Giving everyone access to the different reasons they play seems reasonable.

Besides online play offers everyone easy access to all cards and easy deckbuilding options using the lackey search-database, without the need for buying or printing all the time.
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