[IQ542]

Curious about the interaction between Vidian Kes and Playing By The Rules... If I use Kes' ability to end the attempt and return dilemmas to my opponent's dilemma pile, could I discard a personnel from hand to keep the dilemma I was facing?

[Johannes Mette]

Playing By The Rules
Plays in your core. When a dilemma is about to be returned to a dilemma pile during a mission attempt in which it was faced (or from beneath an incomplete mission), that mission's owner may discard a non-[Bor] personnel from hand to place that dilemma beneath their non-headquarters mission instead.

Kes
While this personnel is facing a dilemma, you may discard a card from hand and stop her and each personnel present to end your mission attempt. That dilemma and all remaining dilemmas in the dilemma stack are returned to their owner’s dilemma pile.

[Johannes Mette]

Curious about the interaction between Vidian Kes and Playing By The Rules... If I use Kes' ability to end the attempt and return dilemmas to my opponent's dilemma pile, could I discard a personnel from hand to keep the dilemma I was facing?

I would say yes

[jadziadax8]

Curious about the interaction between Vidian Kes and Playing By The Rules... If I use Kes' ability to end the attempt and return dilemmas to my opponent's dilemma pile, could I discard a personnel from hand to keep the dilemma I was facing?

I would say yes

I think so, yes. It would only be the one you faced and not all of the ones in the stack.

[Fritzinger]

Doesn’t the same thing happen with tox uthat?

[Johannes Mette]

Tox Uthat
While your personnel present is facing a dilemma, you may place this equipment on the bottom of your deck to end your mission attempt. That dilemma and all remaining dilemmas in the dilemma stack are returned to their owner's dilemma pile.

[Johannes Mette]

Doesn’t the same thing happen with tox uthat?

yep

[Danny]

Someone in our WhatsApp posited “No”.

PbtR triggers when a dilemma’s being returned during a mission attempt, but Kes/Tox end the mission attempt first, then return dilemmas.

[Armus]

Kes:

While this personnel is facing a dilemma, you may discard a card from hand and stop her and each personnel present to end your mission attempt. That dilemma and all remaining dilemmas in the dilemma stack are returned to their owner’s dilemma pile.

Tox Uthat:

While your personnel present is facing a dilemma, you may place this equipment on the bottom of your deck to end your mission attempt. That dilemma and all remaining dilemmas in the dilemma stack are returned to their owner's dilemma pile.

Playing by the Rules

Plays in your core. When a dilemma is about to be returned to a dilemma pile during a mission attempt in which it was faced (or from beneath an incomplete mission), that mission's owner may discard a non-[Bor] personnel from hand to place that dilemma beneath their non-headquarters mission instead.

Emphases mine.

Given the above, I'd say @Danny's WhatsApp buddy has the right of it.

[IQ542]

Seems like this all depends on the timing of Pbtr and Kes' ability.

[Armus]

Seems like this all depends on the timing of Pbtr and Kes' ability.

Timing looks pretty clear to me. Pay the cost, attempt ends, THEN the dilemmas return. There's no point in that timing order to trigger PBTR because the dilemmas have to return DURING the attempt and in the above cases (Kes and Tox), the dilemmas return AFTER the attempt has already ended.

[abargar7510]

I’m with the No’s on this one. For it to be Yes, the cards would have to resolve more or less simultaneously, which to me, contradicts the “Do everything you can” rule when you’re using Kes.

[TReebel]

If I have Kes, Getting Back attempting a mission and Overwhelmed is flipped can I then use Kes's ability to stop the attempt?

[Armus]

If I have Kes, Getting Back attempting a mission and Overwhelmed is flipped can I then use Kes's ability to stop the attempt?

Sure. Why not?