[commdecker]

I have a turn. My opponent has a turn.

Is is not true that your turn had an "end of turn"? And their turn had a "start of turn"? They are not the same turn. As far as game rules are concerned (e.g. Contain Boarding Parties), that was two separate turns -- one for you, and one for them.

[phaserihardlyknowher]

What about a separate term? A round, maybe? Each person has a turn, which together create a round. Both of these are important enough concepts that they need to be distinct, in my opinion.

[Dukat]

I have a turn. My opponent has a turn.

Is is not true that your turn had an "end of turn"? And their turn had a "start of turn"? They are not the same turn. As far as game rules are concerned (e.g. Contain Boarding Parties), that was two separate turns -- one for you, and one for them.

Both players have a right to have the same number of turns, right?

If I just incrementally add one after each turn, meeting that requirement is mathematically impossible.

[nobthehobbit]

Two things are being conflated here: how many turns has each player had, and how many turns has the game had.

If each player has had three turns, the game has had six turns.

[andrewd18]

1. For replaying historical games like @boromirofborg 's battle logs, it's important to know how to track discrete phases of the game, such as turns, in a consistent manner.

I'm not familiar with this, but it sounds like an issue of understanding the context being used there, rather than the game rules.

[*]Yes, I was also thinking of Contain Boarding Parties. If I am not first player, I don't seed it, and I play it on my first possible normal card play, does it count down? Most other cards like it say "your first turn", sidestepping the concern and implying a 1,1 2,2 3,3 measurement but the rulebook @FranklinKenter quoted implies a 1,2,3,4 measurement.

It is as Franklin said. The first turn of the game is the first turn of the first player. The turn after that belongs to the other player; it is not the same turn, and so it is not the first turn of the game.

[*]CC members occasionally talk about a healthy 1E game being "7-9 turns" and I am curious if that is a game with 3-5 normal plays per player or 7-9 normal plays per player.
[/list]

In those discussions, they mean "per player".

These definitions are the perspective I had coming into this discussion (1, 2, 3 numbering). I was confronted with the opposite perspective (0/0, 1/0, 1/1, 2/1 numbering) using the same, no other context added "turn" terminology and thus the thread.

It sounds to me like most people in this thread agree: Turns are to be counted sequentially and not per player. The first player acts on the odd turn numbers, the second player acts on the even turn numbers. If you add "per player" context, then by the end of the game, the quantities of turns for each player are identical. However, at no time did two players get normal plays on the same turn number.

[patrick]

Both players have a right to have the same number of turns, right?

by the end of the game, the quantities of turns for each player are identical

I'm confused... The only reference I could find to having equal number of turns is in Organized Play when the time limit is reached. Am I missing something?

[Armus]

I think y'all are making stuff up or reading things that aren't there.

Turn is defined in the rulebook. It has start of, play, orders, and end of phases. That's a turn. By definition it's for one player.

Why is this creating such a debate?

If y'all are saying we OUGHT to define turn differently then cool, but what's being said here isn't what a turn IS.

[AllenGould]

Why is this creating such a debate?

They want Contain Boarding Parties to not count down if you're player 2.

[Armus]

Why is this creating such a debate?

They want Contain Boarding Parties to not count down if you're player 2.

Ok. Again, that's a perfectly valid opinion. However, I'm reading a lot of IS/OUGHT confusion in here.

Is there something unclear about how the rulebook defines a turn?

[Ashigaru]

I think what's happening is that, if player 2 were to describe their game to someone, they'd say "Alright, so first turn I played..." And the game is going to say "It's your first turn, but it's not the game's first turn." I think in this specific case, it's because Contain Boarding Parties says "...the first turn of the game" that the answer as it currently stands is that it does count down on player 2's first turn.

[eberlems]

seems like a lot of "turn" that are either "full turn", "owner's turn", "every turn", "each turn".

[Armus]

I think what's happening is that, if player 2 were to describe their game to someone, they'd say "Alright, so first turn I played..." And the game is going to say "It's your first turn, but it's not the game's first turn." I think in this specific case, it's because Contain Boarding Parties says "...the first turn of the game" that the answer as it currently stands is that it does count down on player 2's first turn.

Emphasis added. This is the correct reading of the relevant rules and card text.

Is there confusion about that point or do people just not like the fact that that's how it works?

[Ashigaru]

I think this is a case of "That may be the result as things currently stand, but also SHOULD it be?" It wouldn't be the first time we had "The rules currently say X, but that result doesn't seem like what it should be" and it led to a change being made (in this case, if we didn't want Contain Boarding Parties to count down on Player 2's first turn, the correct thing to do would be to errata CBP.)

[andrewd18]

Both players have a right to have the same number of turns, right?

by the end of the game, the quantities of turns for each player are identical

I'm confused... The only reference I could find to having equal number of turns is in Organized Play when the time limit is reached. Am I missing something?

Sorry, not my intent, you are correct. Most of my games go to time and I forgot.

[andrewd18]

I think what's happening is that, if player 2 were to describe their game to someone, they'd say "Alright, so first turn I played..." And the game is going to say "It's your first turn, but it's not the game's first turn." I think in this specific case, it's because Contain Boarding Parties says "...the first turn of the game" that the answer as it currently stands is that it does count down on player 2's first turn.

Emphasis added. This is the correct reading of the relevant rules and card text.

Is there confusion about that point or do people just not like the fact that that's how it works?

I can't speak for people, but I can speak for me. I am not asking for a card change of any kind. I wanted to verify how it worked after being confronted with an alternate counting method. This description matches my initial interpretation.