[Takket]

Dark Matter Pockets and Space Lab Regula I

If I encounter DMP at , do I get the stop from SLRI since the SCIENCE requirement for DMP only applies to encountering it at ?

My inclination is yes, you get the stop, because the stop occurs upon reveal for the dilemma, which is turning the card over and reading it, before the actual encounter begins (which is when you check conditions).

Do I have that right?

Glossary:

Dilemmas revealed and encountered

The initiation of a dilemma encounter begins (i.e. it has been "just revealed" but cannot otherwise be responded to) when the seeded card has been slid out from under the mission, turned face-up, and both players have had the opportunity to read it. After a dilemma is revealed, the dilemma encounter proceeds: targets are chosen and conditions are checked. The initiation of the encounter is complete (i.e. the seed card has been "just encountered" and may be responded to) only when any targets for the dilemma have been chosen and you have checked to see if the crew or Away Team can meet the dilemma's conditions (if any). If the dilemma requires a trigger or specifies targets with specific features which are not present, the dilemma will have no effect, but the initiation is still complete. (See dilemma resolution.)

[Dukat]

I say: No.

At a space mission, the dilemma simply does not have the SCIENCE requirement.

[Takket]

anyone else want to weigh in on this?

[WeAreBack]

I say: No.

At a space mission, the dilemma simply does not have the SCIENCE requirement.

I would agree. I think you need to look at requirements as the card is actually played. If I recall correctly, we had a discussion on the issue of whether Tricyanate poisoning would produce a stop if the mission whose text it was keyed to had SCIENCE as a requirement. My approach would be to give a stop if SCIENCE is something you can use to actually avoid the effect/nullify the dilemma, but as I remember that was not how others felt on that issue.

But "Can I use science to get past/nullify this?" seems like the best approach to me.

[FranklinKenter]

I will disagree.

But "Can I use science to get past/nullify this?" seems like the best approach to me.

But you can use SCIENCE to pass Dark Matter Pockets, there is just an additional requirement that you are at to satisfy the full requirement. For instance, as written you should be able to meet the requirements in space at a dual-icon mission. For contrast, Crystalline Entity specifically delineates between its effects for planet and space; Dark Matter Pockets does not.

I will also add that the card database tags it as a "SCIENCE-related dilemma" insinuating that the trait of "requiring SCIENCE" is an inherent property of the card so that, absent any rule saying otherwise, that trait should apply regardless of context.

Finally, I will point out this question was previously asked here with no resolution:
viewtopic.php?p=610773#p610773

[WeAreBack]

I can certainly see where the argument made by FranklinKenter is coming from. If the dilemma read "To get past requires an away team with 2 SCIENCE OR crew with Navigation and Stellar Cartography" there would be no fight to have at all.

However, as the card is actually worded I don't think its fair to characterize the dilemma as requiring 2 Science and being at a planet mission as one of the methods of overcoming it. Rather, it is saying that at a planet mission the requirement is 2 science. That is, when not at a planet mission, Dark Matter Pockets does not have a science requirement.

Notably, being a "science related" dilemma is not actually the trigger for Spacelab Regula 1. Rather, the triggers are "Dilemmas that require SCIENCE to overcome, cure, or nullify"

So, Pawns of the Militatry is a Science-related dilemma but does not trigger a stop.

Maybe it would be easier for everyone if Spacelab Regula 1 were changed to read "Dilemmas that have the word SCIENCE printed on them, when revealed..." This would give you stops for Dark Matter Pockets but and Pawns of the Militatry but not cards that lacked science before being affected by pawns or Tricyanate Poisoning.